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Nickelless
Administrator
USA
5580 Posts |
 Posted - 10/28/2008 : 15:11:21
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I'd forgotten that I'd called about information from LewRockwell.com a few weeks back and just got a call from one of their reps and talked for about 25 minutes. I mentioned to the rep that I've been buying more scrap silver and/or silverware recently because of the huge markup on pretty much all coins and bullion, and she said the thing I need to keep in mind is the possibility--or was it probability?--of the government making it illegal to own silver bullion and post-1933 silver coins so that people will be forced to turn in their PM so that the government will be able to back the Amero with PM if and when it's rolled out. I told her that while I agreed that the Amero was one direction we could well be heading after the dollar bites the dust, I don't see how practical it is for the feds to try to go after silver--there's too much of it out there (somewhere...) and too much industrial demand for silver for the feds to call it in. She told me that what I needed to do was sell all my bullion and post-1933 Ag coins and buy Peace and Morgan dollars, which would be legal under current law since they were minted before 1933. Granted, the feds COULD ban private ownership of silver coins and bullion just as was the case in 1933, but I really, really can't see that happening now. Am I assuming too much in thinking that the feds won't ban private ownership of silver, or should we all be more afraid than they are? I can see massive uprisings if the feds try to ban ownership of silver and don't see how ticking off hundreds of millions of broke and starving people would help the government's plans to switch to the Amero after the dollar tanks.
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oober
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
1304 Posts |
Posted - 10/28/2008 : 16:55:47
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| Sounds like they just want to upsell you for Morgans and Peace dollars... I read about that going on somewhere, but can't remamber where at the moment. |
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Ardent Listener
Administrator
USA
4841 Posts |
Posted - 10/28/2008 : 17:08:04
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quote:
Originally posted by oober
Sounds like they just want to upsell you for Morgans and Peace dollars... I read about that going on somewhere, but can't remamber where at the moment.
There are companies that push "rare coin" silver and gold as confiscation proof. I don't buy it. I just see it as a way for them to sell you gold and silver at a huge market up. The goverment rules and makes or changes the rules as it wants. |
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fb101
Administrator
USA
2856 Posts |
Posted - 10/28/2008 : 17:18:10
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| I am 95% sure they will not confiscate Collectible coins because it will hurt way too many rich people. I believe you were getting a BS sales pitch and the girl is ignorant. The year 1933 is irrelevant in silver coinage. Gold stopped being legal tender in 1933. Silver remained legal tender until 1969. I have to admit I prefer coinage to bullion products precisely for that reason, but I doubt they'll get too far trying to confiscate my mothers wedding ring or silverware. Most likely to go will be non-US bullion products like kruggerands, pandas, and Maple leafs. Even US bullion products have become collectibles. |
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Cody8404
Penny Hoarding Member
USA
602 Posts |
Posted - 10/28/2008 : 18:02:20
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| We just need to hang on to the SIlver for use on the black market. Doesn't matter what year there, just as long as it is real. |
Awake, O kings of the earth! Come ye, O, come ye, with your gold and your silver, to the help of my people, to the house of the daughters of Zion, to the help of the people of the God of this Land even Jesus Christ. |
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Nickelless
Administrator
USA
5580 Posts |
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Ardent Listener
Administrator
USA
4841 Posts |
Posted - 10/28/2008 : 18:28:10
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quote:
Originally posted by Cody8404
We just need to hang on to the SIlver for use on the black market. Doesn't matter what year there, just as long as it is real.
That is what I think it is coming down too confiscation or not. If there really is a physical shortage of silver then price controls and rationing can't be far behind. The black market will be the only way even industry will be able to obtain theirs. |
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jadedragon
Administrator
Canada
3788 Posts |
Posted - 10/28/2008 : 19:05:05
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Sure Silver is kind of rare, and yes there appears to be a shortage of physical in investment form, but seriously... under what circumstances could the government try to take all the silver away from private owners? Here are a few reasons why that would be pure stupid:
1. Silver is an industrial metal as well, what will people use instead?
2. A lot of silver is in jewelry, silverware, collectable stuff - is the public going to let the government take away grandma's monogramed wedding silverware?
3. a lot of silver fits in a small place. How are they going to find all those silver bars and coins buried in the back yard, under the bed, in the sock drawer, and in concealed safes?
4. Sure the government could go search the safe deposit boxes, but that would take a lot of agents a lot of time. People would move thier silver pretty quick if that started happening.
5. People travel now A LOT MORE then at any time in history - I'm sure silver moves in and out of the country regularly and a lot would just move out to safer locations if it became illegal to own in the USA.
6. Large amounts of illegal drugs, dirty cash, cigarettes, and even stolen cars and kidnapped people move in and out of the USA every day. If required, so could large amounts of silver. Even in a post 9-11 world, the borders leak.
7. There are still silver in circulation to be found. If the government was serious about finding silver they could just start coin roll hunting.
8. The US does not need silver for coins (unless they want to sell ASEs of course), and they do not consider it a strategic metal. What would be the point of taking the silver exactly? |
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pencilvanian
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
2209 Posts |
Posted - 10/28/2008 : 19:22:23
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Don't forget #9
Gold is considered king of metals, silver is viewed as the prince, or at least, the Duke or Baron of metals.
Why would the government bother to go after silver when gold has been the main monetary metal for centuries?
Gold would be the metal that the government would want to back the new dollar, not some industrial metal (Silver.)
They might as well back the Amero with nickel or copper (I hope I am not giving them any ideas.) |
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n/a
deleted
146 Posts |
Posted - 10/29/2008 : 01:18:18
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quote:
Originally posted by Nickelless
I'd forgotten that I'd called about information from LewRockwell.com a few weeks back and just got a call from one of their reps and talked for about 25 minutes. I mentioned to the rep
Lew Rockwell sells gold & silver?
I never knew that, and can't find anything about it on his Web site... |
THE Red Blade
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Kurr
1000+ Penny Miser Member
2906 Posts |
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moboman
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
2555 Posts |
Posted - 10/29/2008 : 08:33:35
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quote:
Originally posted by legacypac
8. The US does not need silver for coins (unless they want to sell ASEs of course), and they do not consider it a strategic metal. What would be the point of taking the silver exactly?
Because they are the government!!!! They do what they want, when they want. What if they decided they needed silver for the war effort, the real patriots (if there are any) would rush to turn their silver in as well as rat on everyone with silver.
Also If the government "bought" your silver and gold, and forced you to invest in the stock market, that would not surprise me. |
"99% of all lawyers give the rest of them a bad name" 
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Nickelless
Administrator
USA
5580 Posts |
Posted - 10/29/2008 : 18:24:15
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quote:
Originally posted by moboman
quote:
Originally posted by legacypac
8. The US does not need silver for coins (unless they want to sell ASEs of course), and they do not consider it a strategic metal. What would be the point of taking the silver exactly?
Because they are the government!!!! They do what they want, when they want. What if they decided they needed silver for the war effort, the real patriots (if there are any) would rush to turn their silver in as well as rat on everyone with silver.
Also If the government "bought" your silver and gold, and forced you to invest in the stock market, that would not surprise me.
In reality I could see them "buying" our gold from us, but does the market value of the outstanding amount of silver--a mere pittance compared to gold--make it worth the government's effort? Or would the more likely scenario be private industry making a pitch for people's silver? I realize I just answered my original question, but figure at least throwing it out for the sake of argument can help us all think of more angles to this.
quote:
Originally posted by legacypac
8. The US does not need silver for coins (unless they want to sell ASEs of course), and they do not consider it a strategic metal. What would be the point of taking the silver exactly?
Other than ASEs, do you really think the feds want to give people the impression, true though it is, that only bullion coins are real money and all other fiat coinage is bogus? That's one reason why I don't think the feds would try to make a major push to obtain private citizens' silver stashes, although they could come up with other lame excuses why they need it, I just can't think of any at the moment.
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Edited by - Nickelless on 10/29/2008 18:27:52 |
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norcal
Penny Pincher Member
USA
107 Posts |
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n/a
deleted
85 Posts |
Posted - 11/01/2008 : 06:46:33
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| If they want my silver they can have it today at $19.00 per ounce. |
"The key to building wealth is to not lose money." - Warren Buffet |
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Copper Catcher
Administrator
USA
2092 Posts |
Posted - 11/01/2008 : 07:37:28
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Come on....The line the woman gave you: "The government making it illegal to own silver bullion." is nothing but crap! First you need to think remember some not so distant past history, the federal government has virtually no inventory of silver, period. No doubt you have seen the bars and coins selling on eBay that at dated in the 80’s saying this silver came from the strategic stockpile reserve.
Just like the government has strategic reserves in oil and other commodities at one time they had reserves in silver but that is no more! Basically the government policy is that silver has “no strategic value” at all. In another words they see no reason to keep it or have it or hoard it, period, end of story!!! I know this is a hard pill to swallow and there are lots of conspiracy theorist that think otherwise but the facts are the facts.
Most of the silver the government had went into making silver eagles i.e. just a bullion coin I might add. If you are worried about silver bullion being illegal then it would be only natural that you would assume gold would be illegal to hold as well. But let’s take this a step further, why would the government want to take your gold and silver it if they could regulate it and keep the price down by market manipulation. Don’t you think that would be easier to do instead of employing a bunch of storm troopers to break down doors and haul what you have away by force? Just a thought because I know folks like a good conspiracy! :-)
Lastly ....concerning the Amero...Dan Carr produced/minted this fantasy coin. That is all it is a fantasy!!! Look at his website: You must be logged in to see this link.
Ugh! it makes me sad that there is all this misdirection and half truths flying around! Wake up everyone, read with caution, and do your own research! |
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ME CO
Penny Pincher Member
USA
199 Posts |
Posted - 11/01/2008 : 15:46:51
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| Lets not forget what they did the last time they confiscated gold. May be why gold and silver are being suppressed so hard spotwise. Gold was what? $20.67 or something, give ME your gold- here's your frns. When they got all they could get- BAM set the price at $35! Nice bit of profiteering. FF to now, give ME your gold heres your pittance- silver too. Say there's 10T FRNS, we don't want 10T Ameros so to have them backed with gold and silver is an easy task of setting a new price. HH Mark |
"54/54/2280" |
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Nickelless
Administrator
USA
5580 Posts |
Posted - 11/01/2008 : 16:38:31
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quote:
Originally posted by ME CO
Lets not forget what they did the last time they confiscated gold. May be why gold and silver are being suppressed so hard spotwise. Gold was what? $20.67 or something, give ME your gold- here's your frns. When they got all they could get- BAM set the price at $35! Nice bit of profiteering. FF to now, give ME your gold heres your pittance- silver too. Say there's 10T FRNS, we don't want 10T Ameros so to have them backed with gold and silver is an easy task of setting a new price. HH Mark
I have less than 3 grams of gold, and that's 14K. I'm not worried. But the feds didn't call in the silver back in 1933, did they? I can't see economically how it would make sense for the feds to call in silver. |
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ME CO
Penny Pincher Member
USA
199 Posts |
Posted - 11/01/2008 : 18:10:16
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quote:
Originally posted by Nickelless
quote:
Originally posted by ME CO
Lets not forget what they did the last time they confiscated gold. May be why gold and silver are being suppressed so hard spotwise. Gold was what? $20.67 or something, give ME your gold- here's your frns. When they got all they could get- BAM set the price at $35! Nice bit of profiteering. FF to now, give ME your gold heres your pittance- silver too. Say there's 10T FRNS, we don't want 10T Ameros so to have them backed with gold and silver is an easy task of setting a new price. HH Mark
I have less than 3 grams of gold, and that's 14K. I'm not worried. But the feds didn't call in the silver back in 1933, did they? I can't see economically how it would make sense for the feds to call in silver.
I wouldn't put anything past them. Alot more of the population hold silver than hold gold (not talking about wedding bands) because of the cost issue. I don't see how they canNot go after the silver too if they do in fact try to confiscate gold. Take the metal and give out worthless paper or worse yet magic debit cards.
I certainly hope they don't go after either- I like my metal.
HH Mark |
"54/54/2280" |
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Nickelless
Administrator
USA
5580 Posts |
Posted - 11/01/2008 : 18:13:08
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quote:
Originally posted by Red_Blade
quote:
Originally posted by Nickelless
I'd forgotten that I'd called about information from LewRockwell.com a few weeks back and just got a call from one of their reps and talked for about 25 minutes. I mentioned to the rep
Lew Rockwell sells gold & silver?
I never knew that, and can't find anything about it on his Web site...
I was wrong, it was Goldworth Financial. I just got their packet in the mail. Maybe I thought it was Lew Rockwell because they both end with an "L". |
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Edited by - Nickelless on 11/01/2008 18:19:48 |
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Bluegill
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
1964 Posts |
Posted - 11/01/2008 : 18:30:26
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I wouldn't put anything past the federal government either. They did it once, they can most certainly do it again.
As for the silver, probably not. But who knows. They may not have any in the reserves because they can have the serfs Citizens hold it for them, saving them money on storage costs. Then just confiscate when needed...
You have to remember, we the sheeple exist to serve the banksters and international financiers. It's all about them, they come first. If it becomes them or the sheeple having real money, who do you think will prevail..? What is good for the Banks is good for Amerika.
I don't think they will swap for FRN's this time. They will give out pre-paid Visa cards. Forcing you to spend-spend-spend.., with restrictions where it can be spent. Making the soon to be nationalized, government owned corporations and businesses money-money-money...
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Nickelless
Administrator
USA
5580 Posts |
Posted - 11/01/2008 : 19:39:46
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quote:
Originally posted by Bluegill
I wouldn't put anything past the federal government either. They did it once, they can most certainly do it again.
As for the silver, probably not. But who knows. They may not have any in the reserves because they can have the serfs Citizens hold it for them, saving them money on storage costs. Then just confiscate when needed...
You have to remember, we the sheeple exist to serve the banksters and international financiers. It's all about them, they come first. If it becomes them or the sheeple having real money, who do you think will prevail..? What is good for the Banks is good for Amerika.
I don't think they will swap for FRN's this time. They will give out pre-paid Visa cards. Forcing you to spend-spend-spend.., with restrictions where it can be spent. Making the soon to be nationalized, government owned corporations and businesses money-money-money...
Wouldn't the feds have to shut down all coin dealers first to grab a large supply of silver? I've sold most of my scrap silver pieces to a local coin dealer, who has paid me cash. I think there would be way too many holes in a federal dragnet for silver, especially given a probable black market for industrial users. Gold would be a different story, but I don't plan on holding much gold at this point, until the Au/Ag price ratio goes down, so I don't have any for the feds to "buy" (er, confiscate) from me. |
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Ardent Listener
Administrator
USA
4841 Posts |
Posted - 11/01/2008 : 20:07:06
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| Any precious metals confiscation would be tough. Much like the penny and nickel melting ban, rather than a confiscation where the goverment searches peoples homes, perhaps they would just discourage people from hoarding by closing the PM markets. If you can't sell on the open market then only the black market will be your option. Most people still won't deal in the black market (if they can even find one) and risk the law inorder to own or hold gold or silver. |
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Nickelless
Administrator
USA
5580 Posts |
Posted - 11/01/2008 : 20:16:07
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quote:
Originally posted by Ardent Listener
Any precious metals confiscation would be tough. Much like the penny and nickel melting ban, rather than a confiscation where the goverment searches peoples homes, perhaps they would just discourage people from hoarding by closing the PM markets. If you can't sell on the open market then only the black market will be your option. Most people still won't deal in the black market (if they can even find one) and risk the law inorder to own or hold gold or silver.
Couldn't, say, U.S. companies that need silver buy from people in the U.S. based upon London silver prices if the feds tried to strong-arm the U.S. markets? Then again, I guess this is assuming a black market, isn't it?
But again, given silver's minuscule market value relative to silver, what would it benefit the feds to try to stop private buying and selling of silver? |
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pencilvanian
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
2209 Posts |
Posted - 11/02/2008 : 13:00:17
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All this talk of confiscating or banning the ownership of gold and silver has made me stop and think about Prohibition.
Prohibition was based on a simple theory, outlaw alcohol and drinking ends.
The problem with the simple theory was people will do as they darn well please, laws or not.
Petty street gangs turned into powerful organized crime syndicates, average citizens who would never dream of breaking the law became involved in the illegal liquor trade (smugglers, basement brewers, speakeasy operators, etc.)
Today, US Citizens are even less respectful of the government and authority than they were in the 1920's. The desire to smuggle & sell their gold and silver overseas would not be viewed as a criminal act but as an act of defiance towards the government (and a tax dodge for some).
For those who smirk and think smuggling can't be done, that gold and silver would be intercepted by the Coast Gurad, it must be remembered that:
1) Gold and silver are NOT easy to detect if hidden or changed into ordinary objects (there wes a story of how drug smugglers cashed in their drug money for gold and turned the gold into tools and painted the golden tools chrome so no one would think they were anything other than ordinary tools.)
2) Gold and silver are not drugs, a drug sniffing dog can find drugs but no one has as yet trained a dog to sniff out PMs.
3) The Coast gurad is searching for smugglers coming INTO US ports, not smuggling contraband out of ports. The Coast Guard can't be everywhere and they can't search every boat on the oceans. It would cause shipping and trade to grind to a halt. Smugglers know this and take advantage of this.
4) Smuggling brings goods in, why can't smuggling ship goods out?
There are more points besides these but you get the idea.
Push comes to shove, people will shove and shove back hard, especially when it comes to their money, especially their real money, gold and silver. |
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Ardent Listener
Administrator
USA
4841 Posts |
Posted - 11/02/2008 : 19:49:38
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quote:
Originally posted by Nickelless
quote:
Originally posted by Ardent Listener
Any precious metals confiscation would be tough. Much like the penny and nickel melting ban, rather than a confiscation where the goverment searches peoples homes, perhaps they would just discourage people from hoarding by closing the PM markets. If you can't sell on the open market then only the black market will be your option. Most people still won't deal in the black market (if they can even find one) and risk the law inorder to own or hold gold or silver.
Couldn't, say, U.S. companies that need silver buy from people in the U.S. based upon London silver prices if the feds tried to strong-arm the U.S. markets? Then again, I guess this is assuming a black market, isn't it?
But again, given silver's minuscule market value relative to silver, what would it benefit the feds to try to stop private buying and selling of silver?
I had the physical PM dealers in mind. Dealers might still be able to buy from people (at a goverment set price) but not sell to the public. Industry will always need their silver so the COMEX or something like it would continue. But an individual wouldn't be able to buy and take delivery from there of course. Hey, it's kind of getting that way already.
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Confiscation of gold and silver to back the Amero
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