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copperbullion
Penny Pincher Member
Australia
136 Posts |
 Posted - 11/27/2007 : 21:26:43
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Tuesday, November 27, 2007
Dear Liberty Dollar Supporters,
Usually at this time of the month, it is the deadline for the Liberty Dollar News, our monthly newsletter that has chronicled the Liberty Dollar for over nine years.
Of course all that came to a screeching halt when the g-boys raided the Liberty Dollar just two weeks ago on Wednesday, November 14. 2007.
So now I am running from the government, afraid for my life and trying to figure out what the hell to do next! Right? Wrong! Nothing could be further from reality. Please read these quick bulleted (no pun) items for a quick review of the latest developments:
IMPORTANT: If you have not received your order and you paid for it with a bank card, please call your bank immediately, cancel the transaction, reversing the transaction and GET YOUR MONEY BACK. Don’t let the government steal your money!
1. First I am not running “from” the g-boys. It is just the opposite. I am running “to” the government. I see the current situation as an ideal opportunity to validate the Liberty Dollar. Otherwise they will have to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that I am guilty and the Liberty Dollar is the scourge of the country. Luckily, my favorite FBI Agent “Andy” just called me yesterday... on my private cell phone. Well the cell phone is suppose to be “private” as most people don’t know the phone number. So I complimented Andy on his resourcefulness and he responded that he was the “FBI”. Now that impressed me and gave me a good secure feeling... because if the FBI could not find my cell phone number, we would really be hurting. In any case, Andy and I had a very “friendly” discussion for about 10-15 minutes. Seems that he wants to “talk” to me. I took that to mean that he wants to arrest me. So I asked about that and sure enough... a Grand Jury, indictment and arrest seems to be a given at this time.
Later in our discussions, when Andy was forth coming with other info, I complimented him on his “friendliness”. To that Andy told me that he (that’s the gov) would be as “friendly” as I was. Well, what is a poor boy to do, especially one in hot water with the feds... but be friendly. So trust me, I intend to be very “friendly”. Seriously, I told my favorite FBI Agent Andy (who I am sure is reading this and can reply if he is so moved...) that I took the government’s raid “very seriously.” To which Andy replied, “And well you should... because the government takes it very seriously too.”
So there you have it, my second call with my very Special Agent Andy. For the record, I spoke briefly to Andy shortly after he and his gang invaded the peaceful Liberty Dollar offices and raided it of everything. And as required, we received an inventory of the all confiscated material. Unfortunately, it was not as detailed as really required... simply stating 500 pounds of silver, without regard to year, weight, denomination or design was way too sloppy for this detailed pone arrestee-in-waiting.
Again, I am running “to” the government to absolve the Liberty Dollar as a legal, private, voluntary, barter currency as soon as possible. I want to get your property back ASAP. Please note this complete post for more important info on how you can help us get your property back.
2. Our first mission is to get your confiscated property back. Please don’t call it stolen... yet. It will only be “stolen” if we lose this case. And God help us all if the Liberty Dollar is found guilty. So please take two actions: First sign up for the Class Action Lawsuit and encourage other people to do so. We need thousands and thousands of people demanding the return of their “stolen property”. Second, we are launching a Legal Defense Fund to defend your right to use Gold and Silver any way you chose. It would be a very dangerous first step if the government started limiting the way you can use your own gold and silver. Please don’t let this happen! Please donate $10 or more to this very serious movement.
Currently we cannot accept donation via a bank card... but we can accept checks, money orders and cash. It is OK to mail your donation to the same old address: Liberty Dollar. 225 N. Stockwell Road. Evansville. Indiana. 47715. Every single dollar, FRN or Liberty Dollar is greatly appreciated.
Stay tune for more exciting ways to donate as we ramp to drive this out of control government back to reality. We can do it... and we need your help.
3. Now lets get serious. Did you read the 35 page Affidavit filed by Agent Andy to show ‘probable cause’ for the issuance of the Search Warrant? If not please go to: You must be logged in to see this link. and read it! Read it very thoroughly. And while you do... ask yourself, “Where’s the crime?” Where is the crime?!!! Usually in such an Affidavit there is all sorts of names, dates, offences, and other info. None of that is in this Affidavit! It seems that I am guilty of selling a t-shirt to Karen, our favorite kinda-undercover agent who was well known from the get-go. Where is the crime? And the idea we were “laundering money” is almost a joke... if it was not such a serious matter. Trust me, this is a serious matter and is being taken most seriously.
4. Equally serious, is your fear that some good natured, smiling, Agent Andy is going to raid your home and confiscate your Liberty Dollars. I know paranoia is rabid. And many of you have good cause to be alarmed. The government’s assault on our liberties and property has been way over the top. And many of us have lost property in the past. But this should only toughen our resolve for this case. But please don’t fear a raid on your place or home. There is no way the government has the resources to mount such an attack with $20 million Liberty Dollars in hundreds of thousand of hands all over our great country. Take precautions, diversify your holdings is prudent for everyone.
While it is not the time to relax and be happy, paranoia is no friend. Good communication is our best companion. So if you hear of some related action, please report it to me directly and stay focused so we can get all our property back.
5. Towards resolving this testy matter, we are interviewing federal criminal attorneys and hope to secure good, dedicated, successful counsel asap. As I mentioned to Agent Andy, I wouldn’t want to meet him without counsel.
6. I was encouraged when Agent Andy told me that he would call me when he knew the schedule so I could “turn myself in”. I thought that was real “friendly” and thanked Andy, as I am obviously not hiding out and prefer that this matter be handled in a gentlemanly way. I just hope the arrest does not interfere with my other commitments. I will be in Evansville on Thursday, attorneys in DC, family for the holidays and please join me for a rare performance as the keynote speaker at the Liberty Forum in Nashua NH on Friday, January 4. Please consider coming to the Liberty Forum... just mention Liberty Dollar and get 10% off. Trust me this is going to be wild... just a couple of days before the big Presidential Primary!!! Come to New Hampshire. Even Agent Andy is welcome. But lets find a convenient time for the arrest...OK?
7. Surprise!!! Speaking of commitments. I will be in Evansville this Thursday, November 29! Open to all. Pot Luck at 6:00. Meeting at 7:00 and out for a beer at 9:00. Everyone is welcome. Please join me at the Liberty Dollar office: 225 N. Stockwell Road Evansville Indiana. 47715. Plenty of free parking. Just off the Lloyd Expressway. Just ask Agent Andy he found us. But I don’t’ think he will be there on Thursday.... but then again... maybe Andy can come out and play... and he might be thereJ
8. Plus... if you did not catch my interview with Glenn Beck on CNN or with Larry Kudlow on CNBC... please visit You must be logged in to see this link. Who would have thought that the raid would generate national news... let alone two shows on the same night and at the same time! The little Liberty Dollar just amazes me.
9. While doing the two national shows was good fun, it was not all the coverage. In fact, there are dozens of newspaper articles. The most amazing coverage came from a most amazing source, The Washington Post. Not only did the Post cover the raid, it was featured on the Front Page, plus it included a image of the Ron Paul Dollar! And if all that was not enough, the article was quite large and REALLY GOOD. It all started when Jan Salsbery, one of many fiery RCOs in California, referred Alec MacGillis, a reporter with the Washington Post to call me. As usual, Alex sounded like a very bright, very young reporter. And as I explained with a certain amount of contempt, you might write a good (truthful) article, but it will be sausage when the editors get done. But very late Friday night Alec called me and said the “editors” liked the story and was going to give it “some space.” Well who would have thought ... Front Page for the Liberty Dollar and Ron Paul?! Now who could image that he will be our next President... I for one! And hope you agree! Our country really needs Ron Paul. As the silver Ron Paul Dollar states: VOTE FOR TRUTH.
PS: To Alec’s credit, he followed up with a call on Monday, and subsequently wrote an additional outstanding article: You must be logged in to see this link.
10. The local television and newspaper also provided very good coverage. It is amazing how many people are interested in the Raid on the little Liberty Dollar and the confiscation of two tons of Ron Paul Dollars. Of course your support is critical to our success. BIG Thanks for all you have done!
11. And finally have you seen the prices of the Ron Paul Gold, Silver and Coppers Dollars. One day the copper is a buck and the next day $65 or more on eBay! Silver is in the $250 to $450 range! Just crazy! And that is not even for the special numbered or hallmarked editions. Are you hip to the Hallmarked Ron Paul Silver Dollars? The Hallmark features a micro scroll with BOR denoting Ron’s respect for the Bill of Rights.
Quite simply, there is a lot to be thankful for. When we started the Liberty Dollar we did not get an instruction manual. We did not know how the Liberty Dollar was going to save the country from a monetary crisis. But we vowed not to let our great country falter without trying. We all, even Agent Andy, have a civic duty to our country. We are commanded by the Declaration of Independence: We hold these truths to be self-evident... That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. We shall not let this country fail to live up to the ideals upon which it was founded by our Founding Fathers. Let us each vow that our country will not falter on my watch!
Now as I face eminent threat of arrest and possibly many years in prison, you have my sincere thanks for supporting the Liberty Dollar that exemplifies those very ideals. Our Founding Fathers fought and died for them, we shall do nothing less.
Remember it is only by banding together and adopting a free and independent currency that provides us with “just weights and measures” will we be able to throw off the yoke of a manipulated monetary/tax system and generate a peaceful and prosperous society.
Change the money / Change the country / Change the world. Do it now!
Bernard von NotHaus
Monetary Architect/Editor
November 27, 2007
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c140cessna
Penny Collector Member
USA
419 Posts |
Posted - 11/27/2007 : 22:30:15
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| I have thought about contacting the FBI Agent "Andy" directly and asking him a few questions and expressing my concerns.....but honestly....I'm affraid of my own Government.....and that is very scary.... |
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NotABigDeal
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
3890 Posts |
Posted - 11/28/2007 : 06:55:44
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Unless you are directly involved with LARGE amounts of Liberty dollars, I would just sit back and watch the show. Not much you as a single person could do except put yourself on their radar.
Deal
p.s. For the record, I do not have any Liberty Dollars. |
Live free or die.
Plain and simple.
"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your council or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen."
- Samuel Adams |
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deleted
7 Posts |
Posted - 12/10/2007 : 23:31:44
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| Too bad that guy wasn't a sovereign. |
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n/a
deleted
17 Posts |
Posted - 12/12/2007 : 14:32:56
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In many ways I think silence is best. Keep your head down and see how it goes.
On the other hand in many parts of the world people go out and riot for their rights. But Americans sit back and watch them slowly leak away.
Is this something that justifies reaction?
I’m going to watch this play out.
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Congress shall have Power To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin, and fix the Standard of Weights and Measures.
To provide for the Punishment of counterfeiting the Securities and current Coin of the United States.
No State shall make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts.
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copperbullion
Penny Pincher Member
Australia
136 Posts |
Posted - 12/15/2007 : 03:56:45
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I have now received a full refund on my visa card for the 100 copper $1 coins that I ordered from liberty. I showed my bank one of liberties emails and asked for a refund, it only took 2 weeks. here is the latest update:
Friday, December 14, 2007
Dear Liberty Dollar Supporters:
Dark Moment for Liberty Dollar
I am shocked to inform you that we have learned that the FBI is moving aggressively to forfeit "their" seizure for auction immediately!
If that does not shock and alarm you, you are truly asleep! If there has ever been a time to support the Liberty Dollar with an Arrest Dollar and a donation… it is now!
Due to higher than anticipated demand for the Arrest Dollar, a printable order from as been created to simplify the process. It is available HERE.
This is so shocking that it makes one wonder what is going on. Unfortunately, the draconian raid/seizure/forfeiture by this government is SOP - Standard Operating Procedures! In fact, the more you learn, the worse it is. Once raided, the victim need not be arrested or even charged with a crime before his/her property can be forfeited and auctioned. This is so common that the police often refer to the seized property as "their" property. After all, like any common thief, they stole it… its "theirs"! Or so they would have you think!
Wait! It is not quite that simple with the Liberty Dollar. You see, I considered this dirty, stinking government trick when I designed and developed the Warehouse Receipt (WR) program. And although I didn't think they would really be this bad or simply ignorant… there is no doubt now. For that reason I am not the signatory on the Warehouse Receipt. Nor could I sign the WR because I am not the Warehouse Official. I don't even work for the warehouse. Remember the warehouse is totally independent and the official issuer of the warehouse receipt. NORFED, Liberty Services, myself, everybody who uses them are simply distributors of the receipts.
But the worst news is "economic persecution". Now we have to fight for your property… with nothing because they took everything in the raid. If we hadn't received some donations to get a new computer, we wouldn't even be able to send out this cry for help. This is very serious!
The Search/Seizure Warrants were for property at specific addresses. The property they seized at Sunshine backed the legal, signed Warehouse Receipts. That property was, and still is, owned by the bearers of the warehouse receipts and the digital Liberty Dollar holders. That is your property that they are trying to steal!
So in all fairness, I don't think Agent Andy and the FBI who raided the warehouse at Sunshine Mint know what they are doing. Yes, they can certainly be more damaging than a village idiot, but they may not know much more. It is obvious that they don't understand how a warehouse receipt program works. Except for my personal account at Sunshine, none of the confiscated material at Sunshine Mint was my property. It was YOURS!
Now! Are you going to let the US government steal your property?!
Click HERE to sign up for the Class Action Lawsuit.
You did nothing illegal! You heard about the new "inflation proof" currency and decided to check it out on line at You must be logged in to see this link. You did your own "due diligence". You read quotes by the government that the Liberty Dollar was legal and that it was not counterfeit. Many of you even called the Fulfillment Office to check out the new currency. Then you made an informed decision to exchange some of your depreciating US dollars for some appreciating gold and silver based Liberty Dollars in specie, paper warehouse receipts and digital form.
Owning gold and silver in any form is not illegal! Over 500,000 individual legal binding warehouse receipts have been issued over the past ten years. Over 25,000+ individuals have visited our site and gotten Liberty Dollars. Neither you nor I are guilty.
Nor did you violate Title 18, Section 486 either. Even US Mint Director Edmond C. Moy acknowledged in a letter to a US Senator that the paper warehouse receipts were not illegal. Section 486 only concerns "use" in metal form. You were not even using the gold and silver. Your property, your metal was stored in the warehouse. You are not guilty. You are a victim!
The gold and silver seized from the issuing warehouse was not the property of the Liberty Services, Liberty Dollar, myself, or even the warehouse... it remains the property of the bearer warehouse receipt holders. It is YOUR property. To date 3,086 people have signed up to be a party to the Lawsuit and GET THEIR PROPERTY BACK.
I ask again: Are you going to let the US government steal your property?!
As bad as all that is, the precious metals industry should be very concerned because if the government can confiscate our gold and silver, they can confiscate theirs. Any raid and liquidation of a private, independent gold and silver warehouse sets an extremely dangerous precedent by this damn government. Where is ICTA - Industry Council for Tangible Assets when we need them?
Now hear this! The government is moving aggressively right now to steal your property!! Please join the Lawsuit to recover the wrongful seizure of your property. If you have not signed up for the Wrongful Seizure Lawsuit (Class Action Lawsuit) do it NOW. It is the only way to get your property back. Please take action immediately! Click HERE to sign up!
Clarification on the Class Action Lawsuit. We have referred to the lawsuit to recover the wrongfully seized property of the Warehouse Receipts and the digital Liberty Dollar holders, as a Class Action Lawsuit. But as we already have 3111 names of the injured parties, this is not a class action lawsuit. We plan to list everybody by name on the lawsuit. We want the judge to see how many people the US government has injured. It is important for the judge to know that thousands of good people from all over the United States, who committed no crime, have been injured and need immediate restitution. We have now renamed the lawsuit to Wrongful Seizure Lawsuit.
Please read the affidavit to establish "Probable Cause" for the Search and Seizure Warrants and ask yourself, "Where is the crime? When did it happen? Where? Who is the injured party?" You must be logged in to see this link.
In Alert #4 I mentioned The Soviet-Style Attack on NORFED by Jacob Hornberger. This excellent commentary is available at: You must be logged in to see this link.
Another excellent commentary, Gestapo raid on coin-producing enterprise by Dr. Richard H. Timberlake, noted monetary economist and expert on the Fed, has been posted at: You must be logged in to see this link.
Dozens of great commentaries are available on the Comment Page at: You must be logged in to see this link.
Thank you for the compliments on getting the digital eLibertyDollar up and running. Please send your digital donations to: Donation@LibertyDollar.org .
While we accept digital Liberty Dollar for donation, it is those damn non-Federal non-Reserve IOU Notes that are needed for the legal defense. Physical Liberty Dollars in paper and digital form that we can auction on eBay for more depreciating FRNs would be greatly appreciated too.
We continue to have a problem getting a bank account open. For now, please send all checks and money orders simply made out to BERNARD.
BIG Thanks for your donations. I apologize that I simply do not have time to respond to all the letters and good wishes. But please keep including the letters. It is good to know you are aware that we are fighting for you and your property. You did nothing wrong!
Orders for Arrest Dollars are very appreciated too. A newly created order from is available HERE. Remember they will only be available until I am arrested. So if you want a specially hallmarked Arrest Dollar… please send order now. I have no idea when I will be arrested.
Now as we face the greatest monetary challenge since the Revolutionary War, lets work together to create a free and independent currency that provides us with "just weights and measures". We should not be ripped off by the government money!
Please support the Liberty Dollar with an Arrest Dollar and a donation. Sign up for the Wrongful Seizure Lawsuit today! Please don't let the government steal your money and drive the Liberty Dollar out of business.
BIG thanks for all the prayers, letters and donations we have received!!!
Every donation counts! Thank you!!
Bernard von NotHaus
Monetary Architect/Editor
When the Nazis came for the communists, I remained silent; I was not a communist.
When they locked up the social democrats, I remained silent; I was not a social democrat.
When they came for the trade unionists, I did not speak out; I was not a trade unionist.
When they came for the Jews, I did not speak out; I was not a Jew.
When they came for me, there was no one left to speak out.
Friedrich Gustav Martin Niemöller |
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DadaOrwell
Penny Sorter Member
99 Posts |
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horgad
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
1641 Posts |
Posted - 12/21/2007 : 12:49:22
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And another related update (a few days late, but I just saw it today):
You must be logged in to see this link.
Statement Introducing the Free Competition in Currency Act
13 December 2007
Rep. Ron Paul, M.D.
Madame Speaker, I rise to introduce the Free Competition in Currency Act. This act would eliminate two sections of US Code that, although ostensibly intended to punish counterfeiters, have instead been used by the government to shut down private mints. As anti-counterfeiting measures, these sections are superfluous, as 18 USC 485, 490, and 491 already grant sufficient authority to punish counterfeiters.
The two sections this bill repeals, 18 USC 486 and 489, are so broadly written as to effectively restrict any form of private coinage from competing with the products of the United States Mint. Allowing such statutes to remain in force as a catch-all provision merely encourages prosecutorial abuse. One particular egregious recent example is that of the Liberty Dollar, in which federal agents seized millions of dollars worth of private currency held by a private mint on behalf of thousands of people across the country.
...continued please hit the link!
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Edited by - horgad on 12/21/2007 12:51:12 |
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Liberty dollar update!
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