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12kHz
Penny Sorter Member
USA
83 Posts |
 Posted - 10/13/2009 : 23:28:35
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Hi all,
What does the current market look like for large quantities of copper pennies, say on the order of $10k face value or even more ($30k? $100k?), both buying and selling?
Suppose someone manages to accumulate a sizable hoard and wants to sell. Is there a market for it? I see people talking about selling 70lb boxes, but not so much about multiple tons.
Likewise, suppose someone wants to make a sizable dollar investment without doing the sorting themselves. What are the options? The Portland Mint (You must be logged in to see this link.) looks like one possibility. Are there others?
Just trying to get a sense of the market...
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AGgressive Metal
Administrator
USA
1937 Posts |
Posted - 10/13/2009 : 23:37:38
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| The larger you go, the less premium you will get - at least if you are competing with Portland Mint. The same as the difference between a 1/10th oz gold piece selling for 140% of spot versus the COMEX selling multi-pound bricks for exactly spot. There is a market, but its very small and most people like to keep a purchase of that size very private. |
And he that hath lyberte ought to kepe hit wel / For nothyng is better than lyberte / For lyberte shold not be wel sold for alle the gold and syluer of all the world.
-Caxton's edition of Aesop's Fables, 1484 |
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HoardCopperByTheTon
Administrator
USA
6807 Posts |
Posted - 10/13/2009 : 23:47:40
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There is a market.. for both buying and selling. It is a developing market, and like all markets, there is a spread between buy and sell prices. There are several members here that can provide you with multiple tons. Ideally you would find a seller in your area so you could avoid the significant shipping cost. The 70 pound boxes are generally the cheapest method of shipment, and also a standard unit of measurement. If you wanted 3 tons, then someone would just ship you 90 boxes. The Portland Mint is a good possibility. They are the only seller I know of that offers a storage option. For $50 per month a ton they will store the copper for you. Then when you decide to sell, they will buy it back from you at some percentage of their then current sell price, so you save the expense and hassle of shipping all those tons back. If you want to take delivery, the Portland Mint can ship them in the small boxes or in 1 ton custom crates. You can also purchase multiple ton lots from myself or pennybullion. Obviously as you move up the scale in tonnage the # of buyers that can play at that level diminishes. If one were to accumulate a sizable hoard, there are a few buyers. Most will want to purchase it at a discount off what they can just make a phone call for and have delivered. The bigger the amount you want to move at one time, the thinner the market is. Right now you can purchase significant amounts for below melt.. including shipping.  |
If your percentages are low.. just sort more. If your percentages are high.. just sort more.
Now selling Copper pennies. 1.6x plus shipping. Limited amounts available. |
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barrytrot
Administrator
USA
721 Posts |
Posted - 10/14/2009 : 07:39:36
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Hoard: It's $50 per 6 months to store with Portland mint.
To OP: I'll echo what Hoard said somewhat: The cool thing is no matter how much or little you have or what you can buy/sell it! The bad thing is that regardless you can't get "true value" i.e. bullion value + shipping. One day you probably will be able to get that though, so if you are selling, I would hold off or sell part and keep part back. If you are buying, however, it is one of the only precious metals I'm aware of that you can get for less than it's worth! So buy or sort all you can :) |
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HoardCopperByTheTon
Administrator
USA
6807 Posts |
Posted - 10/14/2009 : 09:33:43
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Oops.. sorry about that. $50 every 6 months is very reasonable.
I have sold for more than BV in the past.. but markets fluctuate. Current trading values are well below BV.. but of course that is subject to change.
Barry.. while many of us consider copper to be precious, I don't think it has achieved PM status.. still a Base Metal. |
If your percentages are low.. just sort more. If your percentages are high.. just sort more.
Now selling Copper pennies. 1.6x plus shipping. Limited amounts available. |
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barrytrot
Administrator
USA
721 Posts |
Posted - 10/14/2009 : 09:44:18
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Definition of PM = "A precious metal is a rare naturally occurring metallic chemical element of high economic value, which is not radioactive (excluding natural polonium, radium, actinium and protactinium)."
Copper is definitely that, although "high economic value" could be argued somewhat. "High" is unfortunately arbitrary. In many countries where income is $1 per day, a kilogram of refined copper would cost them a week's wages. If I spent a week's wages on something I'd call it a high price. :)
But yes, most people don't call it a "PM". And You must be logged in to see this link. in fact goes on to compare copper to a PM :)
In either case, I will defend my position :) based on the fact that:
1. Quite a large number of people treat it as such.
2. It has an intrinsic metal value.
3. It is rare. I definitely want more if it than I have, which is sort of the definition of rare :) |
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highroller4321
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
2648 Posts |
Posted - 10/14/2009 : 09:58:57
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quote:
Originally posted by 12kHz
Hi all,
What does the current market look like for large quantities of copper pennies, say on the order of $10k face value or even more ($30k? $100k?), both buying and selling?
Suppose someone manages to accumulate a sizable hoard and wants to sell. Is there a market for it? I see people talking about selling 70lb boxes, but not so much about multiple tons.
Likewise, suppose someone wants to make a sizable dollar investment without doing the sorting themselves. What are the options? The Portland Mint (You must be logged in to see this link.) looks like one possibility. Are there others?
Just trying to get a sense of the market...
First off I would like to welcome you to the forum! Look around and post often
I am the owner of The Portland Mint. Thank you for taking the time to visit the site and check us out.
If you are looking to get a large number of copper pennies, without sorting yourself, there are only a few options. There is only 1 other company, besides mine, that sells in "large" volume. There are a few members here on the forum that would be able to supply you with "higher" volumes but most on here like to hoard instead of sell.
Shipping is what really kills the deal on larger volumes. Thats why I am offering a storage option at a rate of $50 every 6 months.
Also right now the movement of large quantities is a little soft. The market is starting to get made more and more everyday so things will only get easier and smoother as time goes by. The Portland Mint is the only company that will buy copper back from you, if its stored in our contracted depository. We even post out buy back price so that you know what to expect when you go to sell.
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Copper Penny Investing
www.portlandmint.com |
Edited by - highroller4321 on 10/14/2009 10:10:56 |
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12kHz
Penny Sorter Member
USA
83 Posts |
Posted - 10/14/2009 : 17:45:02
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Thanks everyone for the responses, and thank you highroller4321 for the welcome. This seems to be a friendly crowd.
It hadn't occurred to me that 70 pound boxes would be the most economical way to ship even large quantities. I guess it is a quirk of the flat rate pricing. Still, shipping costs take a significant bite out of the transaction, so there is a lot of appeal to the Portlant Mint's storage option where those costs can be avoided. That doesn't work for someone who wants to sort themselves though. |
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highroller4321
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
2648 Posts |
Posted - 10/15/2009 : 10:18:18
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quote:
Originally posted by 12kHz
Thanks everyone for the responses, and thank you highroller4321 for the welcome. This seems to be a friendly crowd.
It hadn't occurred to me that 70 pound boxes would be the most economical way to ship even large quantities. I guess it is a quirk of the flat rate pricing. Still, shipping costs take a significant bite out of the transaction, so there is a lot of appeal to the Portlant Mint's storage option where those costs can be avoided. That doesn't work for someone who wants to sort themselves though.
We are a very friendly crowd and will try to answers any questions you have so feel free to ask
Yes, 68lb boxes are the cheapest way to ship small amounts of heavy things around. The reason its 68lbs is because there is a 70lb limit on the box and you have to account for the box weight and all the tape you have to use.
If you wish to aquire a lot of copper and also wish to store it yourselves the cost of shipping really depends on how much you are looking to get. For instant if you buy a semi load (20-24 tons?) the cost per ton is going to be a lot less than if you just buy 2 tons. Also depending on where you live the cost might not be that bad. |
Copper Penny Investing
www.portlandmint.com |
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Market for larger quantities of copper cents?
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