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double dot
Penny Sorter Member
USA
55 Posts |
 Posted - 07/04/2009 : 09:08:30
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$60 in customer wrapped rolls from my local bank. Saw 15 Florida odd colored (yellow/pink) rolls of pennies when I live in NY. I weigh the rolls 145 grams (about 50% copper ). Newest coin is 1985. Composed mostly 1983 and 1984 in AU condition.
Sigh … diverted from CU vs. ZN again. So, although I promised not to do this again, out comes the magnifying glass for 1983 double die and 1984 double ear check. Nope, burnt a 2nd time.
But one of the 1984 pennies is wrong. There is a ghostly but shiny image of the memorial on the obverse ( front ) that looks like it was stamped lightly before the front was stamped. Up & [down] (edited) is almost aligned on both obverse images with about a 10 degree difference. The back is [almost] normal [ two stress cracks ] (edited). If the coin was not in AU condition, the ghost image would disappear into the brown.
I’m not sure it is brockage, as defined by the red book. If anybody has seen cents like this, I would appreciate your comments.
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Crouching Teller, Hiding Copper |
Edited by - double dot on 07/04/2009 22:22:19 |
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NotABigDeal
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
3890 Posts |
Posted - 07/04/2009 : 10:05:14
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Is the "ghost" image backwards? Or correct?
Deal |
Live free or die.
Plain and simple.
"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your council or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen."
- Samuel Adams |
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HoardCopperByTheTon
Administrator
USA
6807 Posts |
Posted - 07/04/2009 : 10:27:11
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Sounds like a die clash to me. The dies came together without a blank between them and the image of the reverse die was transferred to the obverse die. This is then transferred to subsequent cents stuck with that die until the die wears down or they polish it out. This is sometimes called a "prisoner cent" because it looks like Lincoln is behind bars with the ghost image of the memorial over Abe's profile. Definately a keeper!
There are also folks that try to fake this error by squeezing 2 cents together in a vise to impress the image of one coin on another. Yours is most likely genuine.  |
If your percentages are low.. just sort more. If your percentages are high.. just sort more.
Now selling Copper pennies. 1.6x plus shipping. Limited amounts available. |
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double dot
Penny Sorter Member
USA
55 Posts |
Posted - 07/04/2009 : 11:51:14
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"Is the "ghost" image backwards? Or correct?"
Impossible to tell. The part that shows is bilaterally symetric with nothing visible that could identify right versus left. I can figure out up versus down only by the curve of the column openings. There are no visible letters from the ghost image. The memorial shows on the right and left of Lincoln's head, but not much on the raised parts of his head, except on the low spots at the boundaries of the head. There is a step line on the right and left Lincoln head but that is it for an overlap.
I wish it had bars over his portrait, but the memorial column openings are mostly outside the portrait except for two low areas near the edge of the portrait.
Thanks for your help. |
Crouching Teller, Hiding Copper |
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PreservingThePast
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
1572 Posts |
Posted - 07/04/2009 : 11:52:29
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Cool. Please let us know what you find out about the penny.
Enjoy. |
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PreservingThePast
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
1572 Posts |
Posted - 07/04/2009 : 11:55:27
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Forgot to ask this.
Saw 15 Florida odd colored (yellow/pink) rolls of pennies when I live in NY.
Got pictures??? What do you mean by odd colored and how did you know they came from Florida???
Are coin wrappers not the same across all parts of our country?
Inquiring minds want to know. Just another aspect of this hobby to learn about.
Thanks! |
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double dot
Penny Sorter Member
USA
55 Posts |
Posted - 07/04/2009 : 12:40:46
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per HCBTT "transferred to subsequent cents stuck with that die until the die wears down"
As the die wears down, the faint image would wear down on the high spots of the die first - so the bars would fade from the portrait first - stop I'm an idiot. The high spots on a coin correspond with the low spots on the die. So when two dies smack without a planchet, if the low spot of one die is low enough, it won't touch the other die's high or low spot. Now I'm confusing myself.
The rolls are printed Standard Paper Goods Orlando Florida in light red and the background paper is peach colored or beige per my arguing color sighted family members. Like many things manufactured in the US that have disapeared over time, most coin rolls are now Cointainers brand sold by Walmart or if flat type, there are only three or four styles that I normally see. The variety of the old styles was huge but rare now. Some banks used to print their own rolls but even more rarely found.
I found it entertaining but time consuming to make my own coin rolls 6 per sheet of paper with my choice of background paper color and what is printed on them. Since I found a free coin machine at a credit union I have stopped hand rolling. |
Crouching Teller, Hiding Copper |
Edited by - double dot on 07/04/2009 22:13:39 |
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PreservingThePast
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
1572 Posts |
Posted - 07/04/2009 : 12:57:18
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Double Dot...thanks for the info.
I found it entertaining but time consuming to make my own coin rolls 6 per sheet of paper with my choice of paper color and what is printed on them. Since I found a free coin machine at a credit union I have stopped hand rolling.
I just asked at my bank the other day about making wrappers out of plain paper and writing what denomination, amount etc, just like a real coin wrapper in case I ever ran out of wrappers and they said it wasn't allowed. Guess rules vary by banks just like their wrappers too.
This is one interesting hobby.  |
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AgCollector
Penny Collector Member
USA
266 Posts |
Posted - 07/04/2009 : 13:37:30
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quote:
Originally posted by double dot
"Is the "ghost" image backwards? Or correct?"
Impossible to tell. The part that shows is bilaterally symetric with nothing visible that could identify right versus left. I can figure out up versus down only by the curve of the column openings. There are no visible letters from the ghost image. The memorial shows on the right and left of Lincoln's head, but not much on the raised parts of his head, except on the low spots at the boundaries of the head. There is a step line on the right and left Lincoln head but that is it for an overlap.
I wish it had bars over his portrait, but the memorial column openings are mostly outside the portrait except for two low areas near the edge of the portrait.
Thanks for your help.
Does it look like this one? This is a die clash.
You must be logged in to see this link. |
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double dot
Penny Sorter Member
USA
55 Posts |
Posted - 07/04/2009 : 22:07:26
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"Does it look like this one? This is a die clash.
You must be logged in to see this link."
Thanks AgCollector. What a great URL! Looks exactly like the single die clash shown at
You must be logged in to see this link..
After staring and comparing for way too long, I have concluded that the memorial is upsidedown on the obverse in keeping with the die clash. Guess I'll keep it with the zincoln blank planchet I found 9 months ago.  Now, where did I put that?
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Crouching Teller, Hiding Copper |
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HoardCopperByTheTon
Administrator
USA
6807 Posts |
Posted - 07/05/2009 : 00:21:30
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Great link.. I added it to my favorites.
I have a BU roll of these.. showing die progression.. Mine are copper, of course.
I save the older wrappers for a collage I am making of old penny wrappers to mount on the wall of the penny processing center. I like the white and pink horizontal striped ones.. I don't see those very often. Would love to have a few of those Florida wrappers for the artwork. |
If your percentages are low.. just sort more. If your percentages are high.. just sort more.
Now selling Copper pennies. 1.6x plus shipping. Limited amounts available. |
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Pleasant hand sorting diversions
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