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theo
Penny Hoarding Member
USA
588 Posts |
 Posted - 02/21/2009 : 21:53:53
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I've seen a lot of recommendations to buy physical silver (which I have headed), but I haven't seen a lot in terms of how much silver we should own. So how many ounces of silver (or gold) would you want to own? And also; how much longer do you think we'll able to buy bullion at reasonable prices?
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fb101
Administrator
USA
2856 Posts |
Posted - 02/21/2009 : 22:03:51
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I personally want at least 1000 oz, and I have a long way to go. I'd prefer 3-4000 oz.
How much longer we can but it reasonably is a big guess, but every day ticks against it.
What happens if a Euro country goes bust and it's citizens start bidding up PMs?
I don't think it's just the U.S. problems that we're vulnerable to. |
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oober
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
1304 Posts |
Posted - 02/21/2009 : 22:11:56
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It really depends on a few things.
Whats your goal?
My goal is to protect what I have now and if I make a few bucks while I am at it, great.
How long do you have to attain your goal?
As I believe PM's are a hedge against my other investments, my time frame is 5yrs as this is what I expect the time frame will be before the economy really turns around, possible as long as 20yrs...
What % of your disposable income do you plan on investing?
10%
What % of this investment monies do you want to put into PM's?
100% until I reach 25% of overall
How long can you afford to let this money sit in PM's?
This is money I should never need so my time frame is 20yrs.
Now if market conditions still see PM's as favorable I will maintain a certain%, I think PM's are going to be real good for the next 10yrs. After that who knows.
But I think since I got into this, I probably will always have some oney invested, but it may be a smaller % after I have reached my goal and better ventures come along.
To answer your 2nd question... Reasonable price is something you have to determine on your own. Where one person may buy at 16 another may feel this is too high and it may not be reasonable...
Myself I will DCA all the way up to 17.50 before I sit tight for a bit. At that time I will probably pick up bits and pieces, but I will look for more Numis as I feel the premium over spot will be smaller,maybe.
Obviously this is my opinion and I could be way off base, so fair warning to all.
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highroller4321
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
2648 Posts |
Posted - 02/21/2009 : 22:15:50
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| There is no magic number. It all depends on what your goals are, like oober said, and also what you think you will be needing them for. |
Copper Penny Investing
www.portlandmint.com |
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NotABigDeal
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
3890 Posts |
Posted - 02/21/2009 : 22:27:11
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As much as you can....
Deal |
Live free or die.
Plain and simple.
"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your council or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen."
- Samuel Adams |
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n/a
deleted
1 Posts |
Posted - 02/21/2009 : 22:58:33
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| Greetings and salutations! I am new to this forum but have been reading alot of good stuff. I have been recently been buying silver, and stashing it away. I figure what the government don't know what someone has is the better. What type is of silver is considered a good investment? Coins or bullion? |
MOONPIE:0) |
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fb101
Administrator
USA
2856 Posts |
Posted - 02/21/2009 : 23:17:48
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quote:
Originally posted by Moonpie1619
Greetings and salutations! I am new to this forum but have been reading alot of good stuff. I have been recently been buying silver, and stashing it away. I figure what the government don't know what someone has is the better. What type is of silver is considered a good investment? Coins or bullion?
Yes.
(both) |
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Edited by - fb101 on 02/21/2009 23:21:26 |
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theo
Penny Hoarding Member
USA
588 Posts |
Posted - 02/21/2009 : 23:39:25
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quote:
Originally posted by Moonpie1619
Greetings and salutations! I am new to this forum but have been reading alot of good stuff. I have been recently been buying silver, and stashing it away. I figure what the government don't know what someone has is the better. What type is of silver is considered a good investment? Coins or bullion?
Bear in mind that some coins are considered bullion in that they are purchased primarily for their silver. The pre-1965 90% silver quarter and dime are the best examples. |
Edited by - theo on 02/21/2009 23:40:45 |
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ME CO
Penny Pincher Member
USA
199 Posts |
Posted - 02/21/2009 : 23:51:38
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| I saw a post on another forum about gold. Basically said 1oz per person per month for as long as you think you will need it. His scenario was a person age 45 who expects to live to be 85, thats 40 years times 12 months = 480oz of gold. I think I am outclassed on that other forum with my lil hoard but I like to rub keyboards with the rich people too haha. You can however use some basic math and strategy to calculate a good guesstimate. HH Mark |
"54/54/2280" |
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CoinHunter53562
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
1805 Posts |
Posted - 02/21/2009 : 23:56:49
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| I guess this is one area where the saying "the more the merrier" would apply. Everyone's situation is going to be different, but I dont think it would hurt to use some of your disposable income to buy some monthly regardless of price (dollar cost averaging) or just buy on the dips. Either way, I think silver and gold have proven to be pretty liquid so when you need to raise some cash, it's not too hard to find a buyer. Like any other investment, it carries risks but I kinda like having a bit of a stash and would like to get more of course. |
My hobby: collecting real money 1 copper cent or nickel at a time.
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CoinHunter53562
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
1805 Posts |
Posted - 02/21/2009 : 23:59:46
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quote:
Originally posted by theo
quote:
Originally posted by Moonpie1619
Greetings and salutations! I am new to this forum but have been reading alot of good stuff. I have been recently been buying silver, and stashing it away. I figure what the government don't know what someone has is the better. What type is of silver is considered a good investment? Coins or bullion?
Bear in mind that some coins are considered bullion in that they are purchased primarily for their silver. The pre-1965 90% silver quarter and dime are the best examples.
Very true...and dont forget halves! Personally, my allotment of 90% silver is currently:
9% dimes (by total face value)
31% quarters
34% halves
26% dollars
I probably will move some of my dollars and halves into dimes to even it out a little more, but the point is to diversify as with any portfolio. 
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My hobby: collecting real money 1 copper cent or nickel at a time.
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theo
Penny Hoarding Member
USA
588 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2009 : 00:25:11
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quote:
Originally posted by CoinHunter53562
quote:
Originally posted by theo
quote:
Originally posted by Moonpie1619
Greetings and salutations! I am new to this forum but have been reading alot of good stuff. I have been recently been buying silver, and stashing it away. I figure what the government don't know what someone has is the better. What type is of silver is considered a good investment? Coins or bullion?
Bear in mind that some coins are considered bullion in that they are purchased primarily for their silver. The pre-1965 90% silver quarter and dime are the best examples.
Very true...and dont forget halves! Personally, my allotment of 90% silver is currently:
9% dimes (by total face value)
31% quarters
34% halves
26% dollars
I probably will move some of my dollars and halves into dimes to even it out a little more, but the point is to diversify as with any portfolio.
You have a nice mix, but you are right to acquire more dimes. I've also been grabbing some 40% silver Kennedy halves as they are selling for low premiums (sometimes melt value). Some have argued that they won't be as recognized in barter situations. But I think that in a SHTF situation, everybody will quickly become experts in PM coins. Their only real drawback is that they are a little bulky. |
Edited by - theo on 02/22/2009 00:28:59 |
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Nickelless
Administrator
USA
5580 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2009 : 00:41:45
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quote:
Originally posted by CoinHunter53562
I guess this is one area where the saying "the more the merrier" would apply. Everyone's situation is going to be different, but I dont think it would hurt to use some of your disposable income to buy some monthly regardless of price (dollar cost averaging) or just buy on the dips. Either way, I think silver and gold have proven to be pretty liquid so when you need to raise some cash, it's not too hard to find a buyer. Like any other investment, it carries risks but I kinda like having a bit of a stash and would like to get more of course.
I think you hit the nail on the head, CH. The two things I'm not setting an upper limit on are food and PMs. Why would you want to limit yourself on basic means of survival and a store of value? Or to look at the question another way, at what threshold should we stop collecting PM and food and spending our FRNs on less-important things? My take-home pay in 2008 was just under $28K. Percentagewise, I spent about 12% on silver; 20% on food--most of which I bought for long-term storage needs and I have about eight months worth of food on hand for three people; gave 10% to my church and lived off the rest. The real key is using discretionary income to help bolster your safety net, IMO, not "stimulating the economy." I have little actual cash on hand at the moment, but I have ample food, silver which I could sell for more than I bought it if I need cash in a pinch, and the only debt I have besides a $450 credit card balance is my student loans, which I'm paying $205 a month on. I know we have other Dave Ramsey fans on this site who will agree with me that once you really start tracking your expenses and make out a written budget and stick with it, it's amazing how much more money you really end up with once you realize how much you just fritter away on junk. Bottom line, though, don't worry about how much silver, food, etc., is enough, just keep track of what you're spending, cut unnecessary expenses wherever possible and you'll be able to buy more silver or food or whatever than you otherwise thought you'd be able to.
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kieblera5
Penny Hoarding Member
USA
859 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2009 : 00:44:14
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My percentages per FV
35% nickels = 0.09% (had to put that one in there)
dimes= 27%
quarters= 13%
40% halves= 47%
90% halves= 13%
And I don't have any dollars that are strict bullion. I collect them for numis value. |
Democracy is being allowed to vote for the candidate you dislike least.
Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you mercilessly with experience.
Caller number seven gets the Peace Prize!
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Edited by - kieblera5 on 02/22/2009 00:44:32 |
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Nickelless
Administrator
USA
5580 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2009 : 00:45:56
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quote:
Originally posted by theo
You have a nice mix, but you are right to acquire more dimes. I've also been grabbing some 40% silver Kennedy halves as they are selling for low premiums (sometimes melt value). Some have argued that they won't be as recognized in barter situations. But I think that in a SHTF situation, everybody will quickly become experts in PM coins. Their only real drawback is that they are a little bulky.
Theo, a one-foot cube of silver bullion is about 9,500 ounces. If you have that much silver, "bulkiness" won't be a major concern. David Morgan hit the nail on the head:
You must be logged in to see this link.
Your concern shouldn't be bulkiness but purchasing power. I'll bet on silver over FRNs any day.
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Visit my new preparedness site: Preparedness.cc/SurvivalPrep.net
--Latest article: Stocking up on spices to keep food preps lively
---------------
Be prepared...and prepared to help: http://www.survivalblog.com/charity.html
Are you ready spiritually for hard times? http://www.jesusfreak.com/rapture.asp |
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wagsthadog
Penny Hoarding Member
USA
565 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2009 : 02:14:56
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Hi all-
I'm single, so don't really know how it would break down for family men, but I'm following this mantra-
1 year's salary in gold.
1/2 years salary in silver.
Boils down to about 50-100 oz of gold and 3500-4000 oz of silver. I feel that's a very intelligent amount of money to have invested in PM's without going way overboard. I wouldn't buy any 10oz bars of gold or 1000 oz bars of silver- you're asking for trouble. Mixed fractionals in gold coins but not over 1 oz, and Junk 90% silver all the way.
wags |
Only when they CAN'T have it, ......THEN they'll want it.
I love Cents. If you get an UNC box, you win. If you get a regular circ. box, you win. If you get a zinc box, you don't lose....so you still win. |
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rodzm
Penny Pincher Member
USA
143 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2009 : 07:21:05
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| Im having to start from scratch after loosing my shirt in the stock market. $19K absolutely gone in less than a year. My breakdown in PM's as i type this is 20% Gold and 80% Silver. I am currently selling some of the silver to have cash on hand when gold drops. Essentially I would like it to be 50-50 but it is either sell some silver to increase the gold % or buy more gold outright. Im just gonna buy more gold on the dips... |
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oober
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
1304 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2009 : 08:04:59
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quote:
Originally posted by rodzm
Im having to start from scratch after loosing my shirt in the stock market. $19K absolutely gone in less than a year. My breakdown in PM's as i type this is 20% Gold and 80% Silver. I am currently selling some of the silver to have cash on hand when gold drops. Essentially I would like it to be 50-50 but it is either sell some silver to increase the gold % or buy more gold outright. Im just gonna buy more gold on the dips...
IMO, I wouldnt spend too much on gold right now. The Gold to Silver ratio is still hi. I expect it to be 40:1 in the near future. Myself I buy very little gold (1/10 oz a month or so), but will move some of my silver (10% at 60:1, 10% at 55:1, and at reg intervals till I reach a 2:1 stack ratio, 4:1 right now) when the ratio is in my favor for a more balanced holding. |
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Ardent Listener
Administrator
USA
4841 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2009 : 08:51:58
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quote:
Originally posted by NotABigDeal
As much as you can....
Deal
To keep it simple I agree, as much as you can.
The problem when people start hearing things like they should have a ounce of gold per month for the rest of their lives they get discouraged and often don't do anything at all.
But don't forget your preps such as food and a cash reserve for the short term. That is where your stock of copper pennies and nickels could serve you well.
If you start with even one silver eagle today and next week buy another you have increased your holdings 100%.
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Think positive. |
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rodzm
Penny Pincher Member
USA
143 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2009 : 09:50:49
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quote:
Originally posted by oober
IMO, I wouldnt spend too much on gold right now. The Gold to Silver ratio is still hi. I expect it to be 40:1 in the near future. Myself I buy very little gold (1/10 oz a month or so), but will move some of my silver (10% at 60:1, 10% at 55:1, and at reg intervals till I reach a 2:1 stack ratio, 4:1 right now) when the ratio is in my favor for a more balanced holding.
Im only buying gold if its a good deal for example $94 1/10 GAE . I am sellin some silver for when the ratio drops. I will sell mmore when the $16 mark hits and dump it into gold only if the ratio falls below 60 and at that time buy more gold on the way down |
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rodzm
Penny Pincher Member
USA
143 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2009 : 09:54:36
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quote:
Originally posted by Ardent Listener
quote:
Originally posted by NotABigDeal
As much as you can....
Deal
To keep it simple I agree, as much as you can.
The problem when people start hearing things like they should have a ounce of gold per month for the rest of their lives they get discouraged and often don't do anything at all.
But don't forget your preps such as food and a cash reserve for the short term. That is where your stock of copper pennies and nickels could serve you well.
If you start with even one silver eagle today and next week buy another you have increased your holdings 100%.
1 oz of gold per month????? Geez i wish....Have you seen how much us military folks get paid?
My pay for last year wasnt even $30K before taxes...Slow but steady wins the race |
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Tourney64
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
1035 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2009 : 10:51:01
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| I would buy as much gold and silver as I could. Also go with known silver/gold coins or bullion. i.e no bars or coins from Yahoo or Bozo mining company. I like the suggestion of 1 oz of gold/person for every month you expect to live. If I have another 30 years, that would be $720,000 of gold I need to purchase for my wife and me. I think I have that much in copper pennies in my basement....Not. Nice suggestion, but not practical given my financial situation. |
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keys
Penny Collector Member
383 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2009 : 11:16:51
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quote:
Originally posted by Ardent Listener
The problem when people start hearing things like they should have a ounce of gold per month for the rest of their lives they get discouraged and often don't do anything at all.
This is the reason some don't even try to save for the future, open an IRA (or silver IRA) they give up and say 'what's the use?'
The fromula 1 oz gold for a month of living or 1 ounce of silver for a day of living* discourages people to try to save that much, but the so many ounces a day/month doesn't take into many vairables-
1. Do you have land to grow food on? Do you have room for a greenhouse? If so you would need less silver or gold since some or all of your food would come form your own efforts. Less PMs needed in the future means less PMs required to save now.
2. Will you completely give up earning a living when you retire? The PM stash is your own personal Social Security Trust Fund/IRA for you yourself. Since the expert advice is you need so many ounces per month/day to live on I take it to mean you will need so much PMs to sustain you after you retire. If you don't plan on retiring, you keep working and adding to the stash.
If you do plan on retiring and your PM stash isn't enough, you may have to become semi-retired, keep working part time to pay the bills.
Nobody likes working, especially after retirement age, but if a retiree can find a job that they enjoy and pays enough to make ends meet, then working after retirement won't be such a chore.
3. Do you really need 1 ounce of gold a month or one ounce of silver a day for expenses? Some things can be had for lower prices and for less PMs. A month of meals, rent, taxes, etc. might cost 3/4 ounce of gold, maybe 1/2 ounce of gold. There are variables to consider when it comes to the cost of living. Mybe one can get by on less PMs.
* I had heard that the average worker 100 years ago recieved the equivalent of 1 ounce of silver a day. Factor in the costs of how much things cost back then compared to how much they cost today and you can see how inflation has increased over the years. Yet figure out how much things cost in relation to an ounce of silver back then to how much things cost in relation to an ounce of silver today and see if silver lost, gained or maintained its buying power. |
I change with the times-
but like silver coins found in your change
I stay the same.
*****************
The United States of America started out as the new Republic of Rome.
Will The United States of America end up as the New Imperial Rome? |
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ME CO
Penny Pincher Member
USA
199 Posts |
Posted - 02/23/2009 : 08:29:50
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No need to shoot the messenger- I'm in the same boat as you all. Actually I made more money last year selling silver I didn't want than on my real job- now I am a good hunter but my business has been way down for last 6 months- looking up for a time now. So I'm in the accumulate all you can camp as well.
I just thought it interesting that some can actually, mathematically figure out just how much they want to need. These are the same people who scoff at my way of accumulation as a waste of time. HH Mark
BTW the # in my sig is ounces so far this year from CRH- I try to add to it every day. |
"54/54/2280" |
Edited by - ME CO on 02/23/2009 08:32:28 |
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jadedragon
Administrator
Canada
3788 Posts |
Posted - 02/27/2009 : 10:14:34
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Perhaps the advise of "an ounce of gold a month" is for living in a SHTF situation. I could see living off $1000 a month in extreme cirinappropriate languagestances - but storing up that much gold at my age to last the rest of my life? Unlikely! I can see storing up 12 ounces per person to last you out a year of trouble.
ME CO - very odd what word did you use that showed up as a swear word? PM me with it. |
“The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” – George Bernard Shaw.
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Computer Jones
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
1112 Posts |
Posted - 02/28/2009 : 15:47:34
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According to Bunky Hunt and his Bro, you should own all of it!
Sorry, but I've been fighting the urge to post that since this thread popped up, my bad ;p |
There's profit if you melt things!!
8{> |
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How much physical silver should we own?
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