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n/a
deleted
146 Posts |
 Posted - 09/03/2006 : 00:39:03
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I read some more of your posts here. About the hoarding of pre-82 pennies and all nickels for metal content, I have an idea which might work better.
Forget using the coins as the main form of money - if TSHTF, ever, no American currency will be used at all. No one would be able to tell the difference between coins and bills, they would hate anything with a dollar sign, and with the growing international hate towards the US it would be less likely to happen.
If the dollar stopped being legal tender, or if inflation was so bad that eating was more important than following the law, however, scrap metal recycling centers can take old US coins. (I had no idea these things existed until I read some of the posts here.)
In this case, they would need metal that was closer to the pure metal. Someone here pointed out this one recycling center that needed at least 88% copper content to recycle copper. According to Coinflation.com, the pre-82 pennies are 95% copper and the post-82 pennies are 97.5% zinc. According to USMint.gov, nickels, dimes, and quarters are less pure. Forget about Sacajawea dollars - they are a mixture of various metals.
However, it's not all about copper. What if supply and demand changes and zinc becomes more expensive than copper in the future? In this case, your newer pennies would be worth more than your older ones.
So I suggest sticking with the pennies, but "diversifying" by separating zinc pennies from copper ones into different rolls/bags/whatever and keeping both.
Another idea. Unless you have a lot of storage and good security, this gets kinda ridiculous and/or dangerous. Plus, you can earn (fiat) interest/dividends/whatever on perfectly good (fiat) money in the meantime. So keep a private "reserve" of pennies of each type, and as you get more, deposit some into the bank, invest it, or trade it for cash and buy something you like with it. This also would stop aggravating the tellers, since you mentioned they are getting suspicious and/or angry.
What do you think about this?
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"The best way to destroy the capitalist system is to debauch the currency. By a continuing process of inflation governments can confiscate, secretly and unobserved, an important part of the wealth of their citizens." -John Maynard Keynes
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Canadian_Nickle
Penny Hoarding Member
Canada
938 Posts |
Posted - 09/03/2006 : 00:50:01
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| I tried that with Canadian nickels - there are both pure and cupronickel ones, but I soon realized that it made more sense to trade the cupronickel ones back in and get more real nickel. |
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n/a
deleted
146 Posts |
Posted - 09/03/2006 : 00:53:47
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If you're looking at the short-term, copper is a lot more than zinc right now. But market conditions could change, and zinc could become more expensive than copper WTSHTF, which would likely be in the very-long-term and not the short-term.
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"The best way to destroy the capitalist system is to debauch the currency. By a continuing process of inflation governments can confiscate, secretly and unobserved, an important part of the wealth of their citizens." -John Maynard Keynes |
Edited by - n/a on 09/03/2006 00:54:37 |
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n/a
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56 Posts |
Posted - 09/03/2006 : 10:31:29
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Depending on the severity of the situation, I think all metals could have a high value since mines and refining processes could be shutdown. Now that I type this, I'm thinking it would be a good idea to research it and see what readily available metal would be the most versatile. I know copper is good for wiring & bullets. Anyone else?
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n/a
deleted
146 Posts |
Posted - 09/03/2006 : 11:01:48
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quote:
Originally posted by Hooli
I'm thinking it would be a good idea to research it and see what readily available metal would be the most versatile. I know copper is good for wiring & bullets. Anyone else?
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According to Wikipedia (not a reliable source, but may provide some reliable examples and can give a general idea):
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I didn't read through them all, but I did notice something about zinc which may make it more in demand than copper if TSHTF:
"Zinc is used as part of the containers of batteries."
The Copper article on Wikipedia mentions these major categories of uses:
"Electronics:
Structural Engineering:
Household Products:
Coinage:
Biomedical applications:
Chemical applications:
Others:"
Electronics has these uses:
" * Copper wire.
* Electromagnets.
* Electrical machines, especially electromagnetic motors and generators.
* Electrical relays, electrical busbars and electrical switches.
* Vacuum tubes, cathode ray tubes, and the magnetrons in microwave ovens.
* Wave guides for microwave radiation.
* Integrated circuits, increasingly replacing aluminium because of its superior conductivity.
* As a material in the manufacture of computer heatsinks, as a result of its superior heat dissipation capacity to aluminium."
So we may need copper for the manufacture of electronic equipment. But if TSHTF, powering this equipment via simple alkaline batteries would likely be more in demand depending on the situation, and they use zinc. If everyone starts needing batteries all of a sudden, the price of zinc will rise, perhaps above copper, since less people may need the uses of copper.
I suggest saving both copper and zinc.
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"The best way to destroy the capitalist system is to debauch the currency. By a continuing process of inflation governments can confiscate, secretly and unobserved, an important part of the wealth of their citizens." -John Maynard Keynes |
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n/a
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13 Posts |
Posted - 09/03/2006 : 16:17:18
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I keep zinc pennies. They are almost at parity with face value, and will only appreciate. I would only trade zinc pennies for fresh rolls if I simply could not afford to hoard them. Otherwise I would give back only the most worthless form of dollars - paper bills, for fresh coin.
During Weimar hyperinflation, I believe all coins, scrap metal, even doorknobs were preferred for trade, rather than paper money. So I like the nickel, too, even though it is perhaps not as "smelt-worthy". Cupronickel is a useful alloy by itself, although the coin's 75/25 mix is not typical for industrial applications. Shouldn't be a big problem, though. JMO.
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The revolution will not be televised... |
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Ardent Listener
Administrator
USA
4841 Posts |
Posted - 09/03/2006 : 16:40:31
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If you are going through the trouble of obtaining pennies and liquidity of money tied-up in zincers is not an issue, you might want to consider hoarding the zinc cents too. The day will come when you will not be able to get them like you can now.
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If you can conceive it and believe it, you can achieve it. -Napoleon Hill |
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ImperialFleet
Penny Pincher Member
USA
217 Posts |
Posted - 09/03/2006 : 18:15:00
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For what it's worth, and although I may have mentioned it elsewhere on here; I hoard 1 box of Zinc cents for every 3 boxes of Copper cents. Security and storage space isn't an issue for me, besides, there isn't much to worry about theft when it comes to hoarding 100' of pounds of metals...most theives wouldn't spend the time to lift and move the stuff, let alone recognize the actual value.
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“Ultimately, the Fed can flood the system by buying any kind of asset, or even dropping bank notes from helicopters" -Fed Chairman Ben Bernanke |
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Metalophile
Penny Collector Member
USA
320 Posts |
Posted - 09/05/2006 : 08:23:53
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I think zinc is mostly used in primary, non-rechargeable batteries. WSHTF, yes, zinc carbon batteries should be pretty easy to make, and zinc may be a survival item. It might also be useful in galvanizing steel. But then you should also consider hoarding scrap lead. With lead, rechargeable batteries can be made. I have a homemade solar panel along with a lead-acid marine battery in my garage in case of emergency. That gives me more DC power than I could ever hope to get by fashioning homemade Zinc-Carbon or alkaline cells.
Metalophile |
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I have a better idea.
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