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 Silver Bullion, Gold, & other Bullion Metals
 Other Precious Metals - Palladium and Platinum
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PennySaved
1000+ Penny Miser Member


USA
1720 Posts

Posted - 12/09/2009 :  09:29:00  Show Profile Send PennySaved a Private Message
I see a lot on the forum about gold and silver but don't see much about investing in Platinum or Palladium. What is your feeling on those 2 precious metals? Do most of you just stick with gold and silver?

SELLING COPPER PENNIES 1.4X FACE SHIPPED......“I sincerely believe that banking establishments are more dangerous than standing armies, and that the principles of spending money to be paid by posterity, under the name of funding, is but swindling futurity on a large scale” Thomas Jefferson

Copper Catcher
Administrator



USA
2092 Posts

Posted - 12/09/2009 :  17:13:57  Show Profile Send Copper Catcher a Private Message
I have always like platinum because of the all the new uses as well as the rarity of the metal, You must be logged in to see this link.

It is amazing that it takes ten tons of ore and a five month process to make up just one ounce of platinum!

"The six metals of the platinum group (pgm) occur in nature in close association with one another and with nickel and copper. They are among the least abundant of the Earth's elements. Of the few known deposits, those in South Africa and Russia are by far the largest. There are fewer than ten significant pgm mining companies in the world.

Platinum and palladium have the greatest economic importance and are found in the largest quantities. The other four pgm - rhodium, ruthenium, iridium and osmium - are produced only as co-products of platinum and palladium."

Source: You must be logged in to see this link.

With this metal you have to be willing to hang on for the roller coaster ride it will give you. Long term, however, I think it will continue to go up in value. It is not for everyone, but if you can afford it, go for it!
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Lemon Thrower
1000+ Penny Miser Member



USA
1588 Posts

Posted - 12/09/2009 :  17:25:52  Show Profile Send Lemon Thrower a Private Message
plat and pdm have not traditionally been used as money.

copper, silver and gold have.

plat and pdm might increase in value with gold, but there is less assurance of that.

plat has some uses in hi tech that are unique.

pdm is cheaper and can be substituted for plat in some applications, but not all.

they are essentially base metals and tied to economic activity.

they are more of a speculation in my view then a real money play. i bought some pdm under 200 i think a year ago when it was cheap precisely because it was cheap. i wouldn't put a lot of your eggs in this basket and i think the people who are causing the uptick in investment demand in gold and silver are unlikely to put much of their assets into these.

Buying:
Peace/Morgan G+ at $15.00
copper cents at 1.3X
wheat pennies at 3X


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n/a
deleted



478 Posts

Posted - 12/10/2009 :  06:33:09  Show Profile Send n/a a Private Message
You may want to look into the "W" burnished Platinum Eagles in smaller denominations like 1/10th or 1/4 oz. These were produced in tiny numbers from 2006 to 2008. Long term, these may have some serious collector value. Not many USA coins were produced in such tiny numbers. Only a few thousand of the "W" uncirculated were produced for each year and they are no longer being made.

You must be logged in to see this link.

Burnished "W" Platinum Eagle Mintage

Date 1 oz. 1/2 oz. 1/4 oz. 1/10 oz.
2006 3,068* 2,577* 2,676* 3,544*
2007 4,177* 3,635* 3,690* 5,556*
2008 2,876 2,253 2,481 3,706

Edited by - n/a on 12/10/2009 06:37:32
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Lemon Thrower
1000+ Penny Miser Member



USA
1588 Posts

Posted - 12/10/2009 :  08:24:45  Show Profile Send Lemon Thrower a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by CuproNickle

You may want to look into the "W" burnished Platinum Eagles in smaller denominations like 1/10th or 1/4 oz. These were produced in tiny numbers from 2006 to 2008. Long term, these may have some serious collector value. Not many USA coins were produced in such tiny numbers. Only a few thousand of the "W" uncirculated were produced for each year and they are no longer being made.

You must be logged in to see this link.

Burnished "W" Platinum Eagle Mintage

Date 1 oz. 1/2 oz. 1/4 oz. 1/10 oz.
2006 3,068* 2,577* 2,676* 3,544*
2007 4,177* 3,635* 3,690* 5,556*
2008 2,876 2,253 2,481 3,706




how much of a numismatic premium do those low mintage coins command?

Buying:
Peace/Morgan G+ at $15.00
copper cents at 1.3X
wheat pennies at 3X


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n/a
deleted



478 Posts

Posted - 12/10/2009 :  08:59:34  Show Profile Send n/a a Private Message
I bought a few from APMEX early in 2009 and they sent me 2008 "W" burnished coins for the regular price still in the mint capsules. I had to look them up as these looked different from the ones I ordered. That was way before the production figures came out as nobody knew they would be so low. The mint has cancelled all future production of platinum eagles. I started to smile once I realized how few of these were made.

I'd expect the premiums to be high but as a long term investment, they may turn out to be one of the more rare USA bullion coins. Just my opinion but there were only 2481 uncirculated 2008 Platinum 1/4 oz Eagles produced. There are a few on EBAY but most have already been sent off for grading and placed in the plastic holders.
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coppernickel
Penny Pincher Member



USA
131 Posts

Posted - 12/10/2009 :  16:05:42  Show Profile Send coppernickel a Private Message
These two metals are very expensive compared to the knowledge base.

If I take a silver dollar into the public many will know what it is. The same for a gold coin.

If I take a silver colored coin into public even if it were certified in a case that says platinum I doubt many people would accept it.

There was a news story about a man taking 1 ounce gold eagles into a town square and trying to sell them. No one would take them even at face value!

Gold, silver and copper people know, but platinum and paladium they just don't know. For emergency use, store of wealth, ability to trade gold, silver and copper fit the bill. Pal . . . What?




Silver Monometalism is the most permanent and stable form of money the world has seen. Natural law and history prove silver value is best multiplied by gold and best divided by copper. It is only in this counterfeit currency time when the natural law appears suspended.
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Neckro
1000+ Penny Miser Member



Saudi Arabia
2080 Posts

Posted - 12/10/2009 :  16:12:53  Show Profile  Send Neckro an AOL message  Click to see Neckro's MSN Messenger address  Send Neckro a Yahoo! Message Send Neckro a Private Message
I got some Palladium. It's a nice paperweight

Trolling is an art.
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n/a
deleted



478 Posts

Posted - 12/10/2009 :  17:21:44  Show Profile Send n/a a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by coppernickel

These two metals are very expensive compared to the knowledge base.

If I take a silver dollar into the public many will know what it is. The same for a gold coin.

If I take a silver colored coin into public even if it were certified in a case that says platinum I doubt many people would accept it.

There was a news story about a man taking 1 ounce gold eagles into a town square and trying to sell them. No one would take them even at face value!

Gold, silver and copper people know, but platinum and paladium they just don't know. For emergency use, store of wealth, ability to trade gold, silver and copper fit the bill. Pal . . . What?







Collectors know. That's who you'd be selling "w" burnished eagles to. Not many people know the true value of a 1909-S VDB either. I wonder how many coin shops have bought them for a few dollars from unsuspecting customers??
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Lemon Thrower
1000+ Penny Miser Member



USA
1588 Posts

Posted - 12/11/2009 :  05:37:37  Show Profile Send Lemon Thrower a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by CuproNickle

quote:
Originally posted by coppernickel

These two metals are very expensive compared to the knowledge base.

If I take a silver dollar into the public many will know what it is. The same for a gold coin.

If I take a silver colored coin into public even if it were certified in a case that says platinum I doubt many people would accept it.

There was a news story about a man taking 1 ounce gold eagles into a town square and trying to sell them. No one would take them even at face value!

Gold, silver and copper people know, but platinum and paladium they just don't know. For emergency use, store of wealth, ability to trade gold, silver and copper fit the bill. Pal . . . What?







Collectors know. That's who you'd be selling "w" burnished eagles to. Not many people know the true value of a 1909-S VDB either. I wonder how many coin shops have bought them for a few dollars from unsuspecting customers??



the facts you cite might make it a good numismatic play or good speculation. but there plat an palladium have very little in common with gold and silver. If gold goes up by a factor of 30 during this bull market, there is no guarantee pdm goes up by a similar factor or up at all.

I own some, but its a speculation.

Buying:
Peace/Morgan G+ at $15.00
copper cents at 1.3X
wheat pennies at 3X


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n/a
deleted



478 Posts

Posted - 12/11/2009 :  10:42:25  Show Profile Send n/a a Private Message
Platinum 2 year chart shows a high of $2273 oz and a low of $773 oz.
Gold 2 year chart shows a high of $1212.50 oz and a low of $712.50 oz.
Silver 2 year chart shows a high of $20.92 oz and a low of $8.88 oz.

Source Kitco charts: You must be logged in to see this link.

Platinum is much more volatile but the rewards can be huge. I bought my Platinum Eagles early this year when spot platinum was around $940 oz. It's trading at $1419 oz today. The rule I use is buy platinum under $1000 oz. It won't stay there long. Platinum is so rare compared to gold. A talking head on CNBC said that all the gold ever produced would fill an olympic sized swimming pool. All the platinum ever produced in that same pool would not even cover your ankles.

Edited by - n/a on 12/11/2009 10:51:06
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Lemon Thrower
1000+ Penny Miser Member



USA
1588 Posts

Posted - 12/11/2009 :  11:08:20  Show Profile Send Lemon Thrower a Private Message
when was the first platinum or palladium coin struck?

Buying:
Peace/Morgan G+ at $15.00
copper cents at 1.3X
wheat pennies at 3X


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n/a
deleted



478 Posts

Posted - 12/11/2009 :  11:26:24  Show Profile Send n/a a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Lemon Thrower

when was the first platinum or palladium coin struck?



According to this link, Russia first made a platinum coin in 1828.

You must be logged in to see this link.

In 1828, Russia became the first major country to mint platinum coins. In 1907, Cartier made the first wristwatch fashioned from platinum, and by the Art Deco period, platinum had become the most fashionable precious metal used in jewelry in Europe and in the U ' S. Platinum's remarkable qualities make it essential for a myriad of uses. Its molecular weight (almost twice that of lead), unusually high melting point (3,215'F) and extreme durability are useful in high temperature, high pressure production. The metal also has strong catalytic properties, which allow it to quicken chemical processes, and its inert nature makes it useful in products requiring contact with human bodies. Platinum is also highly sensitive and conductive, and therefore ideal for applications in high-tech sensors and radar. Today, platinum is considered one of the most vital and versatile elements available to mankind. Whether as elegant jewelry, medicine, a chemical catalyst, or an investment, platinum makes diverse and unparalleled contributions to our everyday lives.


Here are some facts about platinum:
You must be logged in to see this link.

All the platinum ever mined would fit in the average size living room!
Annually, only about 133 tons of platinum are mined, compared to about 1,782 tons of gold.
Louis XVI of France proclaimed platinum the only metal fit for royalty!
10 tons of ore and a five month process is needed to make up one ounce of platinum.


Here's a link with a pie graph that shows the uses for platinum:
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Autocatalyst uses 50.4% of all platinum followed by jewlery at 24.7%.
Investment sized coins or bars are a tiny fraction of platinum production.

Wiki Platinum link. Note map with known reserves:
You must be logged in to see this link.

Edited by - n/a on 12/11/2009 11:50:28
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Lemon Thrower
1000+ Penny Miser Member



USA
1588 Posts

Posted - 12/11/2009 :  13:06:32  Show Profile Send Lemon Thrower a Private Message
Q. how long have gold and silver been used as money?

A. at least since the time of christ.

Buying:
Peace/Morgan G+ at $15.00
copper cents at 1.3X
wheat pennies at 3X


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