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jman1237
Penny Sorter Member
USA
52 Posts |
 Posted - 08/08/2009 : 09:06:38
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HI Everyone,
I am new to sorting copper, I have set up several bank accounts and
have been getting some good supplies of pennies available. Although, it is quite a hassle, lugging the bags and buckets back and forth.
I have noticed that many of you are "pros" or at least very experienced in hoarding and am asking for a few tips.
One question I have a had a difficult time with is making this sort
of a break even so I can continue getting more pennies without having to short my budget. I have tried selling bags on ebay without much success. Also, another good sign is when I talk to friends or aquaintances about the idea they look at me like I am nuts. This to me means I am on the right track.
here's a couple of other questions:
Is pennybullion from Ebay on here and do you or anyone else feel it is cost effective to get the Federal Storage bags starting out?
What is the best way to transport the zincs back to the bank, (2 wheel cart?) also, I have noticed that the tellers hate changing the bags and it can take up to 15 minutes for only $100 in zincs to dump.
How do you drive drive those college kids or old timers who save every penny they ever earned for years then just dump em in a CD at the bank or a coinstar machine, advertising on local free websites or craigslist has not worked for me. I have even stated I would pick them up and/or pay a slight premium, yet no response?
What are good ways for sorting wheats? I have been using the manual method, trying to catch them as they sort too, but I always miss at least 10 from $100 face sorted. So I have to go back through and hand pick them again.
Another important issue is just in setting up your machine, I often find myself leaning or straining to sort wheats or clearing jams, etc.
Does anyone recommend having at least 2 machines?
one more, I get a lot of pennies rolled from the banks and it is a pain to unroll them, I have been zipping a cut in them with a utility knife but this still takes considerable time and not a good idea to have my kids help with, thought don't mind splitting the cut roll and dumping them into a bowl or bucket? any better ideas for this?
thanks a million!!!
Jman1237
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Jason Rasset
http://iamabullionaire.wordpress.com/ |
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Tourney64
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
1035 Posts |
Posted - 08/08/2009 : 12:15:52
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Welcome
Pennybullion from EBay was a on here, but he got a scholarship somewhere in Europe and so he has stopped his hoarding for now.
I use buckets to transport coin back to the bank, becasue they have a fast coin counter and it's free. Depending on the bank, the coin counters can be slow or fast. Some require rolled, so people like HCBTT roll all theirs with their Glory Coin wrapper. Coinstart machines tend to be a lot slower than other coin counters at banks and of course they are expensive to use.
The only way today to catch all the weats is to sort them by hand. You can sort only older wheats by using the ryedale sorter. The older wheats typically will go into the zinc piles. The older zincs go to zinc, because they have tin in them. You can quickly sort them out with a quick glance.
Large volume would be very beneficial to have 2 Ryedales.
I used to zip the rolls too, but I changed to a different method. I take the paper rolls and use pliers to pull off each end. It's fast, doesn't damage the coins, and every single coin comes out every time. |
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HoardCopperByTheTon
Administrator
USA
6807 Posts |
Posted - 08/09/2009 : 00:12:25
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quote:
Originally posted by jman1237
HI Everyone,
Welcome to the forum jman.
I am new to sorting copper, I have set up several bank accounts and
have been getting some good supplies of pennies available. Although, it is quite a hassle, lugging the bags and buckets back and forth.
Nobody ever said there wasn't "work" involved. Just think of what you are saving on gym membership fees.
I have noticed that many of you are "pros" or at least very experienced in hoarding and am asking for a few tips.
One question I have a had a difficult time with is making this sort
of a break even so I can continue getting more pennies without having to short my budget. I have tried selling bags on ebay without much success. Also, another good sign is when I talk to friends or aquaintances about the idea they look at me like I am nuts. This to me means I am on the right track.
Breakeven is easy, as long as you don't factor in time and gas. You don't even have to sort. Just stack the boxes up.. you are at breakeven.
The market is very thin and flat at this time. Ebay and paypal fees have made that venue for selling marginal at best, especially with the decline in prices and larger sellers such as PennyBullion effectively capping any posibility of auctions gone wild by offering large amounts at Walmart BIN prices. There is a market in Buy/Sell area on this forum.
here's a couple of other questions:
Is pennybullion from Ebay on here and do you or anyone else feel it is cost effective to get the Federal Storage bags starting out?
PennyBullion learned a lot from this forum when he first started out. He came up with a great marketing plan and spent a lot of time developing his business.
What is the best way to transport the zincs back to the bank, (2 wheel cart?) also, I have noticed that the tellers hate changing the bags and it can take up to 15 minutes for only $100 in zincs to dump.
4 wheel cart/dolly with fold down handle. You don't always have to dump at self service counters.. some banks will take precounted bags or rolled boxes.
How do you drive drive those college kids or old timers who save every penny they ever earned for years then just dump em in a CD at the bank or a coinstar machine, advertising on local free websites or craigslist has not worked for me. I have even stated I would pick them up and/or pay a slight premium, yet no response?
Develop good relationships with main coin tellers at your banks.. they will call you when large penny shipments are deposited and you just stop by and pick them up.
What are good ways for sorting wheats? I have been using the manual method, trying to catch them as they sort too, but I always miss at least 10 from $100 face sorted. So I have to go back through and hand pick them again.
Scanomatic! The way we used to do it in the old days. Or eyeball. Or just consider them copper and an acceptable loss if it is too much trouble for you to sort them out.
Another important issue is just in setting up your machine, I often find myself leaning or straining to sort wheats or clearing jams, etc.
Does anyone recommend having at least 2 machines?
2 or 3 is nice, but you really only need 1 unless you are doing serious volume or have some helpers.
one more, I get a lot of pennies rolled from the banks and it is a pain to unroll them, I have been zipping a cut in them with a utility knife but this still takes considerable time and not a good idea to have my kids help with, thought don't mind splitting the cut roll and dumping them into a bowl or bucket? any better ideas for this?
Rollcracker 1000! It will automatically open both paper and plastic wrapped rolls at the rate of 100 rolls per minute! Whacking on a 1/4 inch steel plate workbench opens them really fast for me. Then you just dump them in wheelbarrows, tubs, buckets, or directly into one of your Ryedales.
thanks a million!!!
Jman1237
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If your percentages are low.. just sort more. If your percentages are high.. just sort more.
Now selling Copper pennies. 1.6x plus shipping. Limited amounts available. |
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jadedragon
Administrator
Canada
3788 Posts |
Posted - 08/09/2009 : 00:32:28
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| None of us has the Rollcracker 1000 but we can all dream... it's pretty pricy. I look at this as a good savings account. Many members here just store away copper until the dollar tanks or copper spikes or both. |
“The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” – George Bernard Shaw.
Why Copper Bullion ~~~ Interview with Silver Bullion Producer Market Harmony
Passive Income blog |
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HoardCopperByTheTon
Administrator
USA
6807 Posts |
Posted - 08/09/2009 : 00:41:03
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Yeah, Santa didn't bring one again this year.. even though I had been really good!
I may not have a Rollcracker 1000.. but I do have a Scanomatic! Bet not many members here have one of those.
Tourney.. I don't roll all my zinc. I still bag quite a bit of it for my one dump bank that will take precounted bags. I package it in different ways so I can spread my dumps around a bit. I dumped at 3 banks today and I am getting together dumps for 2 other banks for Monday. It is certainly convenient rolling them up in the comfort of the penny processing center while sorting with the other machines. With 3 of those Glorys (2 10's and a 21) I can roll up a few boxes in no time. Did you ever get your Glory running? |
If your percentages are low.. just sort more. If your percentages are high.. just sort more.
Now selling Copper pennies. 1.6x plus shipping. Limited amounts available. |
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wolvesdad
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
2164 Posts |
Posted - 08/09/2009 : 00:56:48
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I've found that those that try to turn an immediate profit for whatever reason(keep cash flow, make a living, etc) tend to get a little depressed with the whole operation.
Hoarders never get depressed with the copper market. If you are fine with putting back all and whatever copper you get/have then you are good. just sit on it. If you ever have the opportunity to sell(I sold $500 face for $775 once, because I knew I would be moving), and you are happy with the payout, then go ahead. But it's better not to get into the hobby to turn a profit in the near future. THe profits will come after the melt ban has been dropped and copper is selling at $5 a lb or more. 1-10 years down the road.
And I know that even then, many of us on here will not sell anything or everything right away.
If you are having a lot of jams, talk to Andy. You shouldn't have more than 1.5 jams per $25 box. (BUt some areas have dirtier or more corroded pennies than others... that is a factor you can't control and could result in 2-3 jams per $25 in pennies)
Supposedly DriSlide and properly using it and cleaning the machine will make your Ryedale work like a charm. I never had DriSlide so my machine didn't always work like a charm.
Time is a huge factor that can really damper the hobby. Especially with dumping your Zincs. My experience was half the time bad in terms of running it through the machines at the bank. Some took WAY too long and some just took too long and other times it just agitated the tellers for the simple fact that they were having to work.
If you can find a rhythm of when and where to dump your zincs that doesn't cut into family or work time, then you'll be fine. Until then, it could be a hassel.
Sorting coppers is a great opportunity. Not often that the common man can mine his own metal!
I don't currently run a Ryedale, I'm just hand sorting small small amounts. But I may start again later when my situation changes. Either way it is a fun and a smart thing to do! |
"May your percentages ever increase!" |
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beerdoodle
Penny Sorter Member
USA
28 Posts |
Posted - 08/09/2009 : 02:41:58
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| Small time hand sorter myself, just piddling in it. Accumulated almost 9,000 coppers and 200 and some odd wheats. Live a pretty simple life, with no debts. More of a hobby than anything. But the potential gain is huge if you hang in it. Push come to shove, your not out of pocket at all. My goal is a million coppers, looking one at a time. Having fun with it is all that matters to me. |
I am really getting good at barely getting by |
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barrytrot
Administrator
USA
721 Posts |
Posted - 08/09/2009 : 07:32:48
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If you want to make money, as Hoard said, it is simple. Here are the steps:
1. If you are healthy you can put $100 in pennies in a back pack and still bike ride. I've done it many times. Speed is about 70% normal. This yields free pickup and delivery. Less than free if you count that as a workout :)
1.a. However, if you are driving you need to factor in gas and upkeep of your vehicle. So if you use that method take more per trip to mitigate. Figure out the capacity your bank has in terms of how much they will take beforehand :)
2. You can sell your copper here with zero seller fees! 1.33x or lower will get you buyers generally, sometimes 1.4x will as well, but not as often. 1.25x and I will personally take all you have. Minus shipping you are looking at about 5% to 8% face in "profit". Not much, but it adds up over time and makes a very enjoyable hobby cost-negative and you can't say that about any other hobby I'm aware of, unless your hobby happens to be playing professional sports well :)
2.a. Find and read Hoards "how to ship copper" prior to sending! $95 face is the max capacity for a large flat rate box so selling in increments of $95 is your best bet in terms of maximizing your profit!
3. Regarding wheat sort - Wheats are worth 4 cents each. So do some timing calculations and counts to see if the increase in value of 2.67 cents is worth it for the wheats being found. Since you are using a Rydele I can tell you right away: It is not. Naturally keep your eyes open and pull wheats you see but don't worry about them other than that. Wheats are around 4 to 10 per 2,500 coins so slowing down your whole process by 10% and gaining a profit of 26 cents per box is simply not worth it.
3.a. Some here will say, "but what if you pull a 1909-S VDB". You won't. The math on pulling any keys or semi keys will show you that again if you are looking for profitability it simply is not there.
3.b. Some will also say, "but in my last box I had 2,500 wheats". Ok, that means you had someone's collection. In those cases you will definitely notice the wheats unless you open your rolls with a blind fold on :) And if you see a roll with 10+ wheats all by itself I would take that box and mark "hand sort". Sort it while you watch TV during the commercials or something :) |
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Tourney64
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
1035 Posts |
Posted - 08/09/2009 : 10:59:26
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quote:
HoardCopperByTheTon - Tourney64, Did you ever get the Glory running?
No, I paid $20 for a manual, which I thought would help, but didn't solve the issue. I have obtained information on getting a service person out to get it running. Been working ungodly hours at the office, but it looks like it may slow down now that we are back to full staff again. May have it running before the end of September. |
Edited by - Tourney64 on 08/09/2009 11:04:14 |
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HoardCopperByTheTon
Administrator
USA
6807 Posts |
Posted - 08/09/2009 : 11:03:37
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| I have been working ungodly hours at the office too. When things slow down for both of us we can spend some time on the phone and maybe get you up and running. |
If your percentages are low.. just sort more. If your percentages are high.. just sort more.
Now selling Copper pennies. 1.6x plus shipping. Limited amounts available. |
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PreservingThePast
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
1572 Posts |
Posted - 08/09/2009 : 11:06:57
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Jman1237.......as others on here have said. Just have fun with this hobby and if looking at every coin for wheats or possible errors or varieties brings you joy, then that is what is most important.
I believe that a few folks on this site have found some coins that were errors and have sold them to dealers or on eBay for a good little bit of money.
I too love finding the wheat cents and I get as excited with each and every find as if it were gold or silver instead of an old copper cent. I think, should I ever find an IH in a roll; well, who knows what could happen.......!
Just enjoy this hobby. |
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Tourney64
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
1035 Posts |
Posted - 08/09/2009 : 11:28:28
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| I've been selling wheats for 6 cents each, so I do go thru them more thoroughly than most. |
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fb101
Administrator
USA
2856 Posts |
Posted - 08/09/2009 : 11:56:11
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quote:
Originally posted by Tourney64
I've been selling wheats for 6 cents each, so I do go thru them more thoroughly than most.
What venue? |
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Tourney64
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
1035 Posts |
Posted - 08/09/2009 : 12:16:55
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| Selling the wheats for 6 cents each at my office. I have a large number of people who work here. |
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biglouddrunk
Penny Pincher Member
138 Posts |
Posted - 08/09/2009 : 15:58:46
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| If you use a 30-day fix price auction the per month listing fee is only 35 cents. The final value fee is more costly at lower prices than higher prices. So if you want to minimize fees sort til you have something like 500# and put you listing up for a bit lower than pennybullion. If it takes a while to sell no big deal because it's only costing 35 cents per month to list. |
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jonflyfish
Penny Hoarding Member
USA
693 Posts |
Posted - 08/09/2009 : 17:23:09
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quote:
Originally posted by jadedragon
... I look at this as a good savings account. Many members here just store away copper until the dollar tanks or copper spikes or both.
+1 |
The first panacea for a mismanaged nation is inflation of the currency; second is war. Both bring a temporary (and false) prosperity; both bring a permanent ruin. But both are the refuge of political and economic opportunities. |
Edited by - jonflyfish on 08/09/2009 17:24:24 |
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Topic |
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HOW to make this pay for itself??
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