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uthminsta
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
1872 Posts |
 Posted - 12/14/2009 : 22:44:42
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SON OF A...  |
Come to the new and improved realcent: http://realcent.org
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vrbsroma
Penny Collector Member
394 Posts |
Posted - 12/15/2009 : 10:20:58
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| Love these things. How much does a "small" setup cost to get up and running with molds and all? |
As far as I know, it is stated "In God We Trust" on the US dollar. How can I trust this currency if I do not believe in God?
Possession is nine-tenths of the law.
When I give my two cents, they're always copper! |
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JobIII
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
1507 Posts |
Posted - 12/15/2009 : 16:25:20
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MH,
The videos are really fun to watch. That seems like a really hot place to work. How do you purify metals. I've often wondered if you basically get to one metals melt temp and remove the metal that's still solid.
Great videos! |
Selling Copper cents. $0 FV available at 1.4xFV. Also interested in trading for wheat pennies and other coins Please pm me for requests or inquiries.
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Market Harmony
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
1274 Posts |
Posted - 12/15/2009 : 18:33:45
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quote:
Originally posted by giddyup99
Very cool stuff! I can't wait for the next episode.
If you don't mind me asking - What are you melting to make sure you only have 3 toz. in the crucible? Shot or something small like that I would assume.
I get my raw material from either a refinery or I melt down the bars and ingots that I buy from the public. As long as it is pure, I'll cast it into a MH product. I have a large shear which chops down larger pieces in order to fit the silver and gold into my crucibles.
quote:
Originally posted by JobIII
MH,
The videos are really fun to watch. That seems like a really hot place to work. How do you purify metals. I've often wondered if you basically get to one metals melt temp and remove the metal that's still solid.
Great videos!
Refining is performed chemically. Metals are dissovled in acid, then individually dropped out of solution, treated to turn back into elemental metal, and then melted.
I personally do not know of a way to refine in the furnace. Your thought of melting temperature will not work because the metal is already alloyed. |
goto the new and improved realcent: http://realcent.org |
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Delawhere Jack
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
1680 Posts |
Posted - 12/15/2009 : 21:56:10
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Cool vids! I'd hate to see your electric bill though.
As for the camera moving, same thing happens to my spotting scope when I shoot my 45.... Reminds me of stamping codes on keys during my locksmithing days.
Could you make me a ballast weight for my spotting scope out of tungsten...
Seriously though, do you work in any non precious metals? Iron, aluminum? Could you recommend a good source for hobbyist foundry supplies (crucibles, fluxes etc.) for work in base metals? I've been itching to try casting a few things in aluminum or iron.
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"Educate and inform the whole mass of the people... They are the only sure reliance for the preservation of our liberty." Thomas Jefferson
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Dalsuh
Penny Hoarding Member
USA
757 Posts |
Posted - 12/15/2009 : 21:57:37
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Michael, what happened in this video? Any serious injuries yourself?
WARNING CURSING IN THE VIDEO DUE TO AN ACCIDENT
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natsb88
Administrator
USA
1850 Posts |
Posted - 12/15/2009 : 22:12:49
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quote:
Originally posted by Dalsuh
Michael, what happened in this video? Any serious injuries yourself?
Michael is obviously much more qualified to diagnose that than I am, but I'd like to take a shot at it just to see how wrong I am  
What I suspect happened is that the mold was cold and moist. When they poured, it trapped relatively cold air and moisture below the molten metal, the moisture quickly heated and turned to steam (which expands in volume greatly), the steam formed a bubble, and then the bubble popped. Throw that mold in the oven...dry it out and warm it up before pouring liquid metal into it. |
Nate
The Copper Cave
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twocents
Penny Collector Member
398 Posts |
Posted - 12/15/2009 : 22:56:53
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First of all, he is not wearing a face shield. Goggles hardly constitute a face shield. I am willing to bet that molten metal would melt through those cheap goggles in about 2 seconds, let alone scar him for life to the exposed skin on his face. This is precisely why I have no true interest in ever attempting any casting on my own. There is just too much knowledge and expertise needed.
Michael, what do you wear as safety equipment? It is one thing to expose your arms, beside the gloves, but what do you use for face protection? |
Just my two cents! |
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faithnotwork
Penny Pincher Member
USA
121 Posts |
Posted - 12/16/2009 : 05:30:00
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| Dude, now I have to go out and buy some of your products. These are not just bars and bullion, they are ART! |
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JobIII
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
1507 Posts |
Posted - 12/16/2009 : 07:14:45
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| I hope those people didn't get hurt in the film. Glad that wasn't a precious metal splashing all over the place like that. |
Selling Copper cents. $0 FV available at 1.4xFV. Also interested in trading for wheat pennies and other coins Please pm me for requests or inquiries.
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Market Harmony
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
1274 Posts |
Posted - 12/16/2009 : 18:34:19
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quote:
Originally posted by Dalsuh
Michael, what happened in this video? Any serious injuries yourself?
This is my speculation of what happened in that "How NOT to pour aluminum" video. I think Nate was darn close, if not right on, in his theory.
Since there are bars on the table, I'm assuming that they had been casting for quite some time, which means that the ingot mold should have been hot. But, it's not... they must have cooled it in water which, when poured into, caused a steam explosion under the molten aluminum. But the steam explosion was due to entrapment of moisture in the iron mold itself. This is why you see the metal spread from one end and then to the other end, it sets for a split second, and then you hear the *pop* of the explosion. The explosion actully comes from the other end, not where the pour was being introduced, so the steam had an escape route until the aluminum was completely over the entire mold surface... once completely covverd, the steam got trapped, and BAM!
It does not take much moisture to create this explosion. These guys are very lucky. Had there been more moisture, they might have been in serious danger. Especially since Al is one of the worst molten metals to get on your skin. It just keeps burning and burning, whereas copper, silver, and most others will just burn and then stop as their thermal conductivity makes them cool rapidly. But the thermal conductivity properties of aluminum does not allow for it to change tempertures as easily. Thus, it stays hotter, longer.
I've thankfully and luckily never had a molten metal accident. I have, however, had a chemical accident and a broken-thumb stamping accident. I use safety equipment when and where needed. |
goto the new and improved realcent: http://realcent.org |
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JobIII
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
1507 Posts |
Posted - 12/23/2009 : 16:06:00
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Hi MH,
i'm interested to hear about the process of separating 2 metals from an alloy. Say you had copper and silver or whatever. Do you take a strong acid dissolve the alloy, and then titrate it down until one of the metals becomes a solid again?
My thought earlier was more for non alloys, where you can crystalize one compound simply by freezing it in another solution...
Chemistry sure is wonderful. |
Selling Copper cents. $0 FV available at 1.4xFV. Also interested in trading for wheat pennies and other coins Please pm me for requests or inquiries.
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Market Harmony
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
1274 Posts |
Posted - 12/27/2009 : 18:14:32
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quote:
Originally posted by JobIII
Hi MH,
i'm interested to hear about the process of separating 2 metals from an alloy. Say you had copper and silver or whatever. Do you take a strong acid dissolve the alloy, and then titrate it down until one of the metals becomes a solid again?
My thought earlier was more for non alloys, where you can crystalize one compound simply by freezing it in another solution...
Chemistry sure is wonderful.
My preferred refining method is to go directly into Aqua Regia when I know that I'm dealing with gold. This will dissolve gold, platinum group metals, and base metals. They will remain in the liquid until further chemical treatment.
Silver will not be dissolved but will stay in the flask as something like, if not exactly as, silver chloride. The undissolved silver is filtered and then put into a sulfuric acid solution along with some galvanized roofing nails. This will make the undissolved silver turn into elemental silver. Dissolving this again, but in nitric acid, then filtering and then dropping it out, then retreated with the sulfuric acid and nails will get you to 999+ silver after you melt the gray clumps. (this is a long process for the silver)
The remaining filtered aqua regia contains gold, platinum, palladium, and other metals. Gold is dropped out of the urea-neutralized and water-diluted solution with sodium metabisulfite. The sponge is filtered and then redissolved in aqua regia, filtered again, and then treated with urea, water, and dropped with sodium metabisulfite again to produce a sponge that is 999+ pure gold. The remaining precious metals (if any) are taken out of the same solution with other chemicals.
If you are only dealing with an alloy of silver and base metals, then I like to use the inquartation method. After producing the alloy shot, it is dissolved in nitric acid, filtered, and then dropped from the solution with either copper plates or with sodium chloride (salt). The silver will drop out of the solution as silver chloride which is then treated once with sulfuric acid and nails as described above. The resulting metal is 999+ silver. |
goto the new and improved realcent: http://realcent.org |
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jtm3
Penny Pincher Member
USA
187 Posts |
Posted - 12/28/2009 : 18:00:41
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 That is WAY to complicated! |
Copper Cent Hoarding Wiki
coppercenthoarding.wikia.com
+637 posts |
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JobIII
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
1507 Posts |
Posted - 12/29/2009 : 12:40:34
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Hi again MH,
Just a follow up to your very descriptive post. Would you go into the filter process, and is there any literature you'd recommend?
Thanks,
~ JobIII |
Selling Copper cents. $0 FV available at 1.4xFV. Also interested in trading for wheat pennies and other coins Please pm me for requests or inquiries.
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Kurr
1000+ Penny Miser Member
2906 Posts |
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Market Harmony
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
1274 Posts |
Posted - 12/29/2009 : 18:43:15
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quote:
Originally posted by JobIII
Hi again MH,
Just a follow up to your very descriptive post. Would you go into the filter process, and is there any literature you'd recommend?
Thanks,
~ JobIII
The filtering is done under vacuum, in a gooch crucible, with 3 layers of paper filters when the next step is melting, and 1/1/1 paper/fiberglass/paper filters when processing liquid.
Kurr posted some good links and there are 2 books that comes to mind, written by Ammen and Hoke.
Of course, it's much easier, safer, and less expensive to just send the scrap to me. |
goto the new and improved realcent: http://realcent.org |
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Kurr
1000+ Penny Miser Member
2906 Posts |
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Market Harmony
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
1274 Posts |
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johnbrickner
Penny Pincher Member
154 Posts |
Posted - 01/30/2010 : 02:05:32
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| Wicked Cool! Reminds me of when I used to cast lead bullets with my father when I was a kid. |
"I Killed the Bank" from the tombstone of Andrew Jackson |
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Making a video of MH operations
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