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Copper Catcher
Administrator
USA
2092 Posts |
 Posted - 08/23/2008 : 11:22:37
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Like many of you on the board I'm keeping a close eye out on the spot price of silver and buying some when I can. As most of you know, many of the companies that produced this bullion bars and coins, like Engelhard, are no longer making them but you still see them on eBay and they do not appear to be rare as some might claim. So, they have being traded back and forth forever, flowing in and out of the market.
My question: Is there really a shortage of the physical metal silver or not?
If there is indeed a shortage where is it going? Silver itself is not being used in higher amount in production of anything is it? Are the investors/speculators/ folks hording like us really causing the market to dry up or is this just a blip on the screen?
Does it make sense that with silver in the $13.30 an ounce range you not being able to touch a ounce on eBay without pay $15 plus postage or more?
Finally how much over spot would you be willing to pay to get silver bullion and feel happy about it, just curious to know what you think!
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NotABigDeal
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
3890 Posts |
Posted - 08/23/2008 : 11:52:00
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No shortage around me and there never has been. My guy seems to always have silver and gold in nice amounts. If silver hits $10 then who knows....
Deal |
Live free or die.
Plain and simple.
"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your council or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen."
- Samuel Adams |
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Copper Catcher
Administrator
USA
2092 Posts |
Posted - 08/23/2008 : 18:25:20
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| NotABigDeal does the dealer you buy from have 1oz and 10oz brand bars silver bars i.e. Engelhard, Silver Town, A-Mark etc. and if so, what is he selling them for over spot? The best price I can find is .25 over spot plus shipping. Can he meet or beat that? |
Edited by - Copper Catcher on 08/23/2008 18:27:10 |
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natsb88
Administrator
USA
1850 Posts |
Posted - 08/23/2008 : 18:42:33
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| The only local dealer I am aware of never has much silver. I stopped two or three times earlier in the year. Bought a total of two ounces...one 2008 ASE and one generic. |
Nate
The Copper Cave
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Ant
Penny Hoarding Member
USA
894 Posts |
Posted - 08/23/2008 : 20:17:58
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I don't think there's a real physical shortage. Now, if everyone who has "paper" silver decided to take delivery, there would be some scrambling, but there's plenty for the market as it is now. People like us aren't even a blip on the radar.
If local dealers are short, it's likely because they have (1)sold their silver to a larger dealer "upstream" or (2)aren't really out of silver, they just choose not to sell at these lower prices, which may well be lower than what they bought at. |
Lovely dimes, the liveliest coin, the one that really jingles. --Truman Capote
Coins are the metallic footprints of the history of nations. --William H. Woodin |
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Ardent Listener
Administrator
USA
4841 Posts |
Posted - 08/23/2008 : 20:24:41
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| If my local dealers don't have silver items in stock such as 100 ounce bars, they can order it and have it to me within a week. |
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Think positive. |
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Copper Catcher
Administrator
USA
2092 Posts |
Posted - 08/23/2008 : 20:50:14
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Ardent...I know the 100oz silver bar is consider the "investor's bar" but if the price of silver gets as high as it once did I'd be worried about the crooks out going back to drilling out the center and inserting lead like had been done once before. For that reason I don't want to buy a bar like that. However I will break my own rule and buy a Kilo Bar like the Engelhard, Swiss, Argor, or JM bar as long as it is close to spot. They are just sweet looking bars to me and hard to come by!
Again, can anyone beat .25 over spot on the price??? |
Edited by - Copper Catcher on 08/23/2008 21:02:27 |
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Copper Catcher
Administrator
USA
2092 Posts |
Posted - 08/23/2008 : 21:00:57
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Ant, your comment: "Now, if everyone who has "paper" silver decided to take delivery, there would be some scrambling, but there's plenty for the market as it is now." I might be wrong but the way I under stand it all the people who have futures contracts are all given the option without any penalty to pay by cash versus actually having to come up with the physical silver itself.
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Ant
Penny Hoarding Member
USA
894 Posts |
Posted - 08/23/2008 : 22:07:49
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I've never been sure if administrators can pay out the value of the silver to investors at their discretion, or if they can only do it if there is not enough silver available to meet demand. Either way, can you imagine if you had invested thinking that you'd be able to get your physical silver when you asked for it, and getting a check instead?    |
Lovely dimes, the liveliest coin, the one that really jingles. --Truman Capote
Coins are the metallic footprints of the history of nations. --William H. Woodin |
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Computer Jones
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
1112 Posts |
Posted - 08/23/2008 : 22:31:52
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The "spot" price of silver is being manipulated away from the "what I can buy it for in my home town" price.
Ted Butler gives a good explanation here:
You must be logged in to see this link.
I can buy all the bars and rounds I want (well I guess I mean have FRN's available to plunk down) in 1 and 10 ounce form, but the lowest price that they can be had is $15.00 in my neck of the woods.
It don't matter what "spot' is, the premium seems to adjust and soak up any kind of profit margin for the little guy. |
There's profit if you melt things!!
8{> |
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NotABigDeal
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
3890 Posts |
Posted - 08/23/2008 : 22:40:15
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I can't make it back to my dealer until sometime this coming week at the earliest. He keeps kinda crazy hours, but most of the time it is worth it as his stock is usually nice and varied. I was trying to hold off on buying until my birthday, (September 18 if anyone wants to send something). I'll check it out as soon as I can. I have to try and stop by during my work hours as he is not open on the weekends. If he has any for close, do you want some? Are rounds okay as long as they are the brands you requested? I'll gladly pick some up for you and ship them to you if they are available. No promises....
Deal |
Live free or die.
Plain and simple.
"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your council or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen."
- Samuel Adams |
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Nickelless
Administrator
USA
5580 Posts |
Posted - 08/24/2008 : 04:53:55
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quote:
Originally posted by Computer Jones
The "spot" price of silver is being manipulated away from the "what I can buy it for in my home town" price.
Ted Butler gives a good explanation here:
You must be logged in to see this link.
I can buy all the bars and rounds I want (well I guess I mean have FRN's available to plunk down) in 1 and 10 ounce form, but the lowest price that they can be had is $15.00 in my neck of the woods.
It don't matter what "spot' is, the premium seems to adjust and soak up any kind of profit margin for the little guy.
Thanks for the link, Computer Jones. I saw the story on Coinflation this past week as well. Great article on the shenanigans going on behind the scenes. |
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Copper Catcher
Administrator
USA
2092 Posts |
Posted - 08/25/2008 : 11:32:20
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| Deal, If you can get name brand bars at spot plus.25 I am up for it. Tell me how much you think you can get. I can mail you a check. Also I will be glad to send you a prize on your B-day! too... |
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horgad
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
1641 Posts |
Posted - 08/25/2008 : 12:52:57
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"My question: Is there really a shortage of the physical metal silver or not?"
One theory is that there is a shortage of investment grade silver, but not neccessarily for industrial silver. So the spot price correlates to the much larger industrial silver price, but to not to small bar and rounds prices. If the theory hold out, the spot price will eventually become more real and the shortage in small bars and rounds will work itself out as more silver is diverted into the more lucrative investment category.
Either that or the spot price is just flat out broken because of all the paper silver that is floating around.
Either way something very strange is going on. The supposedly free and efficient silver market is starting to show cracks.
Even the going price for junk silver is now 40¢ over spot shipped when it use to be spot or even less. If you can get small bars or rounds for 25¢ over spot, I say go for it and let me know where. |
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Neckro
1000+ Penny Miser Member
Saudi Arabia
2080 Posts |
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Nickelless
Administrator
USA
5580 Posts |
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jpf231
Penny Collector Member
USA
340 Posts |
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Neckro
1000+ Penny Miser Member
Saudi Arabia
2080 Posts |
Posted - 08/25/2008 : 18:57:29
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| My idea is, as long as I get the bullion for a low cost, and it all gets to me. Then I don't care how long it takes. =) I rather buy it at 14.50 and wait a month, then buy it for 19bucks and wait 2days. |
Trolling is an art. |
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AgCollector
Penny Collector Member
USA
266 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2008 : 07:31:34
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quote:
Originally posted by Neckro
My idea is, as long as I get the bullion for a low cost, and it all gets to me. Then I don't care how long it takes. =) I rather buy it at 14.50 and wait a month, then buy it for 19bucks and wait 2days.
A month might be optimistic- NWT Mint is pretty notorious (at least, on the goldismoney.info board) for not only taking a long time (2-3 months) but also lying to you about when your silver will ship. |
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magnasort
Penny Pincher Member
USA
174 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2008 : 09:59:22
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| Ordered junk 90% from Bullion direct by visa and check, the visa shipment showed in 5 bus days, the check is still clearing. |
Magnetic sorters, no moving parts except the coins |
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Neckro
1000+ Penny Miser Member
Saudi Arabia
2080 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2008 : 11:31:02
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| As long as I get what I paid for. It's still gonna sit in my vault either way. |
Trolling is an art. |
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Is there a real physical shortage of silver?
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