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insurrection1517
Penny Collector Member
USA
262 Posts |
 Posted - 04/16/2008 : 21:36:31
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Hi,
I was just told by a potential seller that you should not insure boxes of pennies when you ship them because it is against regulations to send money in the mail? Is this true, or is this a misunderstanding of the law? I see on the box how it says that there are restrictions when sending cash to an international destination, but nothing about sending it domestically. And even if there were, wouldn't the pennies classify as a collectible?
I can't imagine people selling all these wheat pennies/old coins on ebay are not insuring their packages.
Thanks.
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AFModell
Penny Sorter Member
USA
82 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2008 : 21:39:56
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| Thats what the post man told me a few days ago. You cannot insure cash or cash equivalents through the USPS. Anyone else, correct me if I am wrong, please. |
A penny saved is...TWO pennies earned! |
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HoardCopperByTheTon
Administrator
USA
6807 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2008 : 21:42:20
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| I think it says in the fine print on the box that there are restrictions for shipping any cash or cash equivalents through the mail. The post office doesn't trust their employees for some reason. Also they are worried about their folks transporting what they consider cash.. as it makes them more of a target. Usually the post office wants you to send cash by Registered mail.. which would cost a fortune. I have insured packages in the past if it makes the buyer more comfortable. Fortunately I have never had to file a claim. I have heard no stories of anyone filing a claim, but I imagine the PO would deny the claim based on you having shipped cash. |
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insurrection1517
Penny Collector Member
USA
262 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2008 : 21:46:20
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This makes no sense, because that would mean you techinally could not insure wheat pennies or any other coins you send in the mail.
And if they are really restricted, than how come the post office is letting us get away with shipping so many of them.
Also, it has that note on the side of the box underneath "International Restrictions." It says nothing of any domestic restrictions. Is there truly a domestic restriction on sending these coins through the mail? |
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HoardCopperByTheTon
Administrator
USA
6807 Posts |
Posted - 04/17/2008 : 00:01:45
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I think I read something about it on the USPS website or some place like that also. I am sure not going to ask.. I ship way too many pennies. If they ever ask I just tell them they are copper disks for jewelry making.
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If your percentages are low.. just sort more. If your percentages are high.. just sort more.
Now selling Copper pennies. 1.6x plus shipping. Limited amounts available. |
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Nickelless
Administrator
USA
5580 Posts |
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WheatieFan
Penny Pincher Member
USA
106 Posts |
Posted - 04/17/2008 : 04:18:48
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I doubt the restriction on cash was intended for a sixty pound package of pennies.
The fact that they are being hoarded clearly makes them collectible coins.
Whether they are currently circulated or not shouldn't matter. I would insure a box of state quarters, too.
I'd personally insure them. If you choose not to, just consider yourself "self-insured" and be prepared to eat the costs if something goes wrong.
WheatieFan |
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TXTim
Penny Hoarding Member
629 Posts |
Posted - 04/17/2008 : 07:38:22
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Does the US mint offer insurance when they ship bags to collectors?
It doesn't look like it.
They do, however, recommend that you insure any returned coins. |
Beer is my currency. |
Edited by - TXTim on 04/17/2008 08:54:57 |
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HoardCopperByTheTon
Administrator
USA
6807 Posts |
Posted - 04/17/2008 : 09:09:14
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| I just doubt you would actually be able to collect on a claim if they lost them. The same goes for more expensive coins. Why do you suppose they are generally sent by the much more expensive "Registered" mail instead of just Priority if you could put full insurance on the coins shipped by the Priority mail? It may be that we are paying for a false sense of security by buying postal insurance. They might not pay off.. so you have wasted all that money on their high priced insurance as well as potentially making your package a target by having that "Insured" label. |
If your percentages are low.. just sort more. If your percentages are high.. just sort more.
Now selling Copper pennies. 1.6x plus shipping. Limited amounts available. |
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HoardCopperByTheTon
Administrator
USA
6807 Posts |
Posted - 04/17/2008 : 09:14:16
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quote:
Originally posted by WheatieFan
I doubt the restriction on cash was intended for a sixty pound package of pennies.
The fact that they are being hoarded clearly makes them collectible coins.
Whether they are currently circulated or not shouldn't matter. I would insure a box of state quarters, too.
I doubt the Post Office intended the Flat Rate box for shipping of 60-70 pound packages of pennies.  
No matter how collectable it is, the post office would still consider it "cash." The restrictiction on cash is to protect their carriers from potential criminals and also because they don't want them tempted to spirit away packages. |
If your percentages are low.. just sort more. If your percentages are high.. just sort more.
Now selling Copper pennies. 1.6x plus shipping. Limited amounts available. |
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insurrection1517
Penny Collector Member
USA
262 Posts |
Posted - 04/17/2008 : 09:32:54
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I've bought other coins besides pennies and they have always been sent priority mail or first class with insurance - never registered. I can't believe US postal service refuses to honor insurance on these coins.
I think we need to figure this out for sure, so that we are not wasting our money on insurance, if it is true that they don't honor it. |
Check out my auctions on ebay!: http://shop.ebay.com/lutheranamerican/m.html?_nkw=&_armrs=1&_from=&_ipg=&_trksid=p4340
http://www.mrrebates.com?refid=413556 - 3% cash back on everthing at Ebay - including coins, precious metals, etc. Much better than Ebates.
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Centsearcher
Penny Pincher Member
USA
107 Posts |
Posted - 04/17/2008 : 14:12:30
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| I was told by a postal employee a while back that any coins I send must be sent as registered. This was after I tried to buy insurance on a box of wheat cents. I'm guessing that the post office would not honor the insurance on cash if it was lost, hence the registered requirement. I am not a fan of insurance myself, but would be willing to insure a box if a buyer requested it. |
--Misplaced Numismatist--
Democracy: The only system where any two idiots can out-vote a genius
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insurrection1517
Penny Collector Member
USA
262 Posts |
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TexasPQ
Penny Sorter Member
47 Posts |
Posted - 04/18/2008 : 18:26:01
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I spent a bit of time researching USPS regulations on this matter. The "MAILING STANDARDS OF THE UNITED STATES POSTAL SERVICE" or "DOMESTIC MAIL MANUAL" (DMS) is posted on their website and has a decent search feature to it.
First of all, I searched all nonmailable and restricted items. Currency is NOT listed as a prohibited item. Now there may be some other law on this but there is no restriction listed in the USPS manual.
Here is what I found related to currency and coins, under the section pertaining to insurance claims it states:
DMS, 609, 4.0 Claims:
4.1 Payable Claim
Insurance for loss or damage to insured, registered, or COD mail within the amount covered by the fee paid or within the indemnity limits for Express Mail as explained in 4.2 is payable for the following:
g. Fair market value of stamps and coins of philatelic or numismatic value, as determined by a recognized stamp or coin dealer or current coin and stamp collectors newsletters and trade papers.
o. Except for registered mail, the maximum indemnity for negotiable items (defined as instruments that can be converted to cash without resort to forgery), currency, or bullion, is $15.00.
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So it seems clear that shipping currency and coins can't be illegal otherwise it wouldn't be covered under the insurance. What is interesting is the different way things are classified.
The way I read this is if you shipped and insured (non-registered):
Peace Dollars - Full value coverage because they are numismatic.
Wheat Cents - Full value coverage because they are numismatic.
Copper Cents - Limited coverage to $15 because this is currency.
Silver Eagles - Limited coverage to $15 because this is bullion.
If anyone reads this differently or has other information please share.
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insurrection1517
Penny Collector Member
USA
262 Posts |
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HoardCopperByTheTon
Administrator
USA
6807 Posts |
Posted - 04/18/2008 : 20:16:09
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I only ship numismatic copper cents.. LOL. They bring higher prices that way. Hey, they are in the red book at a price over face value and people collect them.. so that makes them numismatic.
I wonder where the line is drawn between negotiable items (all US coins would be negotiable.. even the Trade Dollar (The coinage act of 1965 remonetized it)) Bullion (Many Peace Dollars would be considered bullion and numismatic (any coin collected that carries a premium)? |
If your percentages are low.. just sort more. If your percentages are high.. just sort more.
Now selling Copper pennies. 1.6x plus shipping. Limited amounts available. |
Edited by - HoardCopperByTheTon on 04/18/2008 20:17:49 |
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JSutter
Penny Pincher Member
214 Posts |
Posted - 04/18/2008 : 22:06:55
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| I have yet to have the Post Office damage or lose a shipment. However I insure at the buyers request. When they ask what's in it I tell them collector coins and no further questions are asked. I'd imagine the cash rule is more geared towards people mailing large sums of money rather than pennies. also they actually are collector coins now. |
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Nickelless
Administrator
USA
5580 Posts |
Posted - 04/19/2008 : 17:40:35
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quote:
Originally posted by JSutter
I have yet to have the Post Office damage or lose a shipment. However I insure at the buyers request. When they ask what's in it I tell them collector coins and no further questions are asked. I'd imagine the cash rule is more geared towards people mailing large sums of money rather than pennies. also they actually are collector coins now.
Who else besides collectors would mail large amounts of coinage anyway? I don't think anyone in their right mind would mail FRNs (although those not in their right minds do this every day). |
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Centsearcher
Penny Pincher Member
USA
107 Posts |
Posted - 04/19/2008 : 21:24:28
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quote:
Originally posted by insurrection1517
So did they refuse to ship the bag of wheat cents then? or just refuse to insure them?
They took them after I paid for registered mail, which was somewhere in the neighborhood of $17. But it was partially my fault, for telling them they were coins...lol |
--Misplaced Numismatist--
Democracy: The only system where any two idiots can out-vote a genius
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swusc
Penny Hoarding Member
USA
553 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2008 : 21:58:12
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You must be logged in to see this link.
Page 12 i think.
They do cover coins of collector value.
-SWUSC |
`Everybody is ignorant. Only on different subjects.' Will Rogers
"This is the shabby secret of the welfare statists' tirades against gold. Deficit spending is simply a scheme for the "hidden" confiscation of wealth. Gold stands in the way of this insidious process. It stands as a protector of property rights. If one grasps this, one has no difficulty in understanding the statists' antagonism toward the gold standard." Alan Greenspan, 1966. |
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Saul Mine
Penny Collector Member
USA
343 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2008 : 22:44:34
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| I ran into that problem once because the shipment was so heavy. The clerk was afraid it was not properly packed. Ever since then I have only used Delivery Confirmation. It's just as good, since the post office almost never loses anything, and you still have a tracking number, which is all anybody on ebay wants. You save money and there are no questions about what's in the box. I would only insure things of high value, and then I would consider registered mail. Ask for advice at the post office about that. |
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Insuring shipments of pennies?
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