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 "but you can't eat silver"
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uthminsta
1000+ Penny Miser Member


USA
1872 Posts

Posted - 09/08/2010 :  13:21:38  Show Profile Send uthminsta a Private Message
Had an odd conversation with a guy in my church the other day, about silver and gold. It's not that he doesn't understand that it's worth having. In fact he has several ounces of physical gold. But he said that it's not "actually" worth having that much or depending on it, "because you can't eat it."

Okayyyy...

Have you encountered this when talking with people about precious metals investing? What response do you give that will help them understand? I did say, but in the event of the collapse of the dollar, small amounts of precious metals would be the ideal means of BUYING food. I'm not very good at this conversation yet... but I want others to know and be prepared more than they are...

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Corsair
Penny Hoarding Member



811 Posts

Posted - 09/08/2010 :  13:28:35  Show Profile  Send Corsair a Yahoo! Message Send Corsair a Private Message
Ask Country. He always has the best explanations for why to hoard SILVER and GOLD.

Just kidding, Country. I've always loved feeling the impact of reading the names of precious metals. Make them feel even more valuable!

So long, Realcent 1. Come visit us at Realcent.org!
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ScottyTX
Penny Hoarding Member



USA
508 Posts

Posted - 09/08/2010 :  13:41:51  Show Profile Send ScottyTX a Private Message
I always see a very valid point in survival situations. I want lead/bullets guns, food, and survival equipment. "Hey there buddy, can I trade you these silver quarters for half your food there". Ummm I'm thinking no unless there's another guy down the road trading survival equipment for silver coins because he has a warewolf infestation. I completely understand there needs to be a means for trade, but to make it in a survival type WTSHTF scenario why would it be gold and silver? To me if the US dollar fails all hell is going to break loose. Sure gold and silver have practical uses but so do shovels, wheelbarrows, axes, and ect. Keep your gold, silver, and copper and give me some lead, gunpowder, food, ect. If the masses are totally inept about the actual real value of gold an silver what makes you think they will trade for it? Something is only worth what someone else is willing to give for it right? You say a silver quarter is worth a loaf of bread, why? I can also jump sides on this but there are glaring questions that always bother me with wtshtf scenario's. Who guarantees silver an gold will still hold there value as they historically have? I have questions I'm sure others have their answers.

Scotty
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jonflyfish
Penny Hoarding Member



USA
693 Posts

Posted - 09/08/2010 :  13:53:29  Show Profile  Send jonflyfish a Yahoo! Message Send jonflyfish a Private Message
"but you can't eat it!" is one of the worst and most common excuses people casually use to excuse the real purpose of PM's.

Can't eat PM's but they have their own intrinsic value whether you value them in FRN or Ameros or whatever.
Can't (err wouldn't) eat FRN's for any nutritious value but you can sure watch the buying power return to the true intrinsic value. At that point, how many potatoes will an ounce of silver buy vs a "worthless" FRN?

The first panacea for a mismanaged nation is inflation of the currency; second is war. Both bring a temporary (and false) prosperity; both bring a permanent ruin. But both are the refuge of political and economic opportunities.

Edited by - jonflyfish on 09/08/2010 13:55:56
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Country
1000+ Penny Miser Member



USA
3121 Posts

Posted - 09/08/2010 :  14:00:56  Show Profile Send Country a Private Message
Scotty makes a great point. Barter and trade during a collapsed society scenario will be accomplished with daily necessary items. Stuff you've gotta have or need. Simple items like toilet paper, canned food, and a bottle of wiskey will have plenty of appeal to the average Joe for trade. The SILVER and GOLD (and COPPER) will need to be hidden away until the crisis passes; it will be much safer for you and your family to take a low profile during this time period. The last thing you want is to end up defending your home (from bad dudes or rogue government confiscators) because the word is out that YOU'VE GOT A PILE GOLD OR SILVER. I think of the SILVER and GOLD as a store of value to be available when society begins to recover after the collapse and when naiscent commerce begins to require monitary forms of payment. If there is a need for new currency, SILVER and GOLD will play their part in it as they always have through past centuries.

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The things that will destroy America are prosperity-at-any-price, peace-at-any-price, safety-first instead of duty-first, the love of soft living, and the get-rich-quick theory of life.
– Theodore Roosevelt

Edited by - Country on 09/08/2010 14:02:48
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AGCoinHunter
Penny Hoarding Member



USA
685 Posts

Posted - 09/08/2010 :  14:55:56  Show Profile Send AGCoinHunter a Private Message
As Country alluded to once civility returns to normal, there will be a need for a medium of trade. This will be where PM's come into play. No, they won’t buy you food when its scarace but when the time comes and those with the good wish to do business, PM's will be used. That is why its wise to stock up on things you will need when society breaks down such as food, whiskey, cigarettes, tp, ect.



"All tyranny needs to gain a foothold is for people of good conscience to remain silent."
-Thomas Jefferson

"There is no difference between communism and socialism, except in the means of achieving the same ultimate end: communism proposes to enslave men by force, socialism—by vote. It is merely the difference between murder and suicide." - Ayn Rand
________________________________________________

Lenin: Class-based International Socialism
Hitler: Race-based National Socialism
Obama: Class- and Race-based Post-National Socialism
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didou
Penny Sorter Member



Canada
47 Posts

Posted - 09/08/2010 :  14:58:44  Show Profile Send didou a Private Message
PM are a way to store large amount of wealth for the long run.
If you're looking to store $100 worth of wealth for 10 years, you have the right tools. Plus it can cost you only half it's price if you sort coins.

Silver and gold will maintain their value on other country currency (can be used to trade it for Euro for example), but lost all it's value in the country where the crash happen. It will only recover in your own country currency after the depression is gone.

I think the depression will still be a good time to buy PM as people will give them away for a little food you have grown. But they won't buy anything unless the seller want to sell his house to leave the country where gold will still worth something.

If you're looking to eat, i think you have the wrong tools and should learn to grow and store food.
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spartan_b88
Penny Sorter Member



USA
27 Posts

Posted - 09/08/2010 :  17:36:00  Show Profile Send spartan_b88 a Private Message
I collect silver and gold only after I feel I have the essentials. Putting all your eggs in one basket is never a good
thing. Nickel copper silver gold lead I've got them all.
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thogey
1000+ Penny Miser Member



USA
1617 Posts

Posted - 09/08/2010 :  17:51:12  Show Profile Send thogey a Private Message
You can't eat silver, you also can't put a months supply of food in your pocket and move from point A to point B.

Copper Silver and Gold has been a medium of trade for a very long time (heck Judas gave up everything there was to give up for 30 lousy pieces), and the only thing we have to orient ourselves to is history.

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BamaJoe
Penny Sorter Member



86 Posts

Posted - 09/08/2010 :  18:49:44  Show Profile Send BamaJoe a Private Message
The "but you can not eat it" argument drives me nuts and either identifies the one using it either as a not having thought things out (at best) or a complete idiot (at worst). Being prepared has multi facets. Food, security, basic medical, heat, lighting, etc. PM's are one of those facets. No, you can not eat silver/gold. Guess what? You can not eat bullets, or shoot a bean, or light a room with a band aid, or use a bean as a band aid, or --- well you get the idea.

Edited by - BamaJoe on 09/08/2010 18:50:27
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Quagmire
Penny Sorter Member



62 Posts

Posted - 09/08/2010 :  19:07:23  Show Profile Send Quagmire a Private Message
I always respond that you cannot eat federal reserve notes, although they do make good firewood and bad toilet paper
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AGgressive Metal
Administrator



USA
1937 Posts

Posted - 09/08/2010 :  19:16:28  Show Profile Send AGgressive Metal a Private Message
Unless there are no markets at all, silver and gold will increase in value during a economic crisis. If there are no markets, you can't eat stocks, bonds, green paper, 401ks, IRAs, cars, books, furniture, or neckties. Ask him if he has any of those things.

And he that hath lyberte ought to kepe hit wel / For nothyng is better than lyberte / For lyberte shold not be wel sold for alle the gold and syluer of all the world.
-Caxton's edition of Aesop's Fables, 1484
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AGgressive Metal
Administrator



USA
1937 Posts

Posted - 09/08/2010 :  19:23:34  Show Profile Send AGgressive Metal a Private Message
This idea that there will be a crisis and all of a sudden no one will accept anything except canned food and ammunition is ridiculous. That has never happened ... anywhere. India, Vietnam, Zimbabwe, Malaysia and all kinds of other places that are way poorer and way hungrier than the US all recognize gold as valuable. Unless you think America is going to suck worse in 2020 than being a peasant in 500 BC, in which case, you should probably just move to Europe or South America.

And he that hath lyberte ought to kepe hit wel / For nothyng is better than lyberte / For lyberte shold not be wel sold for alle the gold and syluer of all the world.
-Caxton's edition of Aesop's Fables, 1484
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redneck
1000+ Penny Miser Member



1273 Posts

Posted - 09/08/2010 :  19:43:47  Show Profile Send redneck a Private Message

quote:
"but you can not eat it"


Sure you can...

All it takes is a little ketchup...

>
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Sheikh_yer_BuTay
Penny Pincher Member



USA
232 Posts

Posted - 09/08/2010 :  20:21:16  Show Profile Send Sheikh_yer_BuTay a Private Message
"You can't eat silver, or gold, or PM's... this is the second time today I have heard this argument. It must be coming from the same source.

News flash every body! Rich people actually DO EAT SILVER IN INDIA! They pound it into a super thin foil and decorate cakes and other foods with it during special celebrations ( like weddings). It is so very thin, most doctors say it will pass thru the digestive tract after people chew and swallow it.

"The most fiscally irresponsible government in American history."
Mort Zuckerman, liberal columnist and former Obama speech writer
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Sheikh_yer_BuTay
Penny Pincher Member



USA
232 Posts

Posted - 09/08/2010 :  20:31:09  Show Profile Send Sheikh_yer_BuTay a Private Message
Scotty has a good argument. We need everything. I am not ready for TSHTF, but I am close. The main thing I now need is enough tillable land to plant some crops with a small hillside next to it for my underground home. I want to be out there where no one knows who I am or what I've got.

Maybe we shall all be lucky and TSHTF never comes. I tell the "you can't eat silver" scoffers I hope they are right and get to laugh their ass off at me some day! But, IF I am right... DON'T come knocking on my door!

"The most fiscally irresponsible government in American history."
Mort Zuckerman, liberal columnist and former Obama speech writer
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frugalcanuck
Penny Pincher Member



Canada
103 Posts

Posted - 09/08/2010 :  20:52:30  Show Profile Send frugalcanuck a Private Message
BamaJoe
I think you said my argument but you said it much better than I useually do.

When I hear that you cant eat gold I get frustrated and go on ranting about something and useually forget to do a proper rebuttle.

One box of Nickels

11.65% .999 Ni
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jonflyfish
Penny Hoarding Member



USA
693 Posts

Posted - 09/08/2010 :  22:35:18  Show Profile  Send jonflyfish a Yahoo! Message Send jonflyfish a Private Message
They couldn't eat silver in 1964 but the value must be more than obvious as we see people scramble over top one another to pay $1.45 for a dime. And why should they? Why would 5,000 Morgan or Peace silver dollars be worth anything more than $5,000 today?

I don't understand why people should even defend the silver in mouth argument. Just let them take dad's old silver dollars down to the Coinstar machine or local bank in exchange for some more desirably delicious and ever so edible FRN's that can be plastered and preserved on the family room walls to leave a legacy for generations to come just like they have been doing for thousands of years through thick and thin, inflation, hyperinflation etc.

The value of a buck may have decreased by 95%+ in the last one hundred years but oh how sweet the "smell of money" is when you surround yourself with it. ;-)

The first panacea for a mismanaged nation is inflation of the currency; second is war. Both bring a temporary (and false) prosperity; both bring a permanent ruin. But both are the refuge of political and economic opportunities.

Edited by - jonflyfish on 09/08/2010 22:38:53
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theo
Penny Hoarding Member



USA
588 Posts

Posted - 09/08/2010 :  22:37:12  Show Profile Send theo a Private Message
"You can't eat silver/gold" sounds like a classic straw man arguement. It assumes that most people who buy physical PMs do not prep in other ways. The vast majority of PM investors I know (you guys included) view them as merely one part of a plan for future incertainty. The "you can't eat PMs" people are most likley not perceptive enough to realize that.

What are some responses to their argument?

1. "Name a time in history when silver and gold had no value."

2. "Food spoils, PMs don't."

3. "How will you pass on your wealth to your children/grandchildren?"

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spartan_b88
Penny Sorter Member



USA
27 Posts

Posted - 09/09/2010 :  00:17:25  Show Profile Send spartan_b88 a Private Message
I guess all of these condensed down is "everything has it's purpose." PMs serve a dual purpose in this argument as a highly liquid, tangible investment/asset. I completely agree with the "beans cant be bandaids and bullets can't be eaten either," arguement. Like bullets or any other asset for that matter, silver and gold may provide a means to obtain what you want. Just like hunting you may not always bag your target going into a "market" though. Food can spoil, guns can rust and unforseen situations can arise. All contingencies must be accounted for.
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