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double dot
Penny Sorter Member
USA
38 Posts |
 Posted - 07/04/2009 : 09:08:30
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$60 in customer wrapped rolls from my local bank. Saw 15 Florida odd colored (yellow/pink) rolls of pennies when I live in NY. I weigh the rolls 145 grams (about 50% copper ). Newest coin is 1985. Composed mostly 1983 and 1984 in AU condition.
Sigh … diverted from CU vs. ZN again. So, although I promised not to do this again, out comes the magnifying glass for 1983 double die and 1984 double ear check. Nope, burnt a 2nd time.
But one of the 1984 pennies is wrong. There is a ghostly but shiny image of the memorial on the obverse ( front ) that looks like it was stamped lightly before the front was stamped. Up & [down] (edited) is almost aligned on both obverse images with about a 10 degree difference. The back is [almost] normal [ two stress cracks ] (edited). If the coin was not in AU condition, the ghost image would disappear into the brown.
I’m not sure it is brockage, as defined by the red book. If anybody has seen cents like this, I would appreciate your comments.
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Edited by - double dot on 07/04/2009 22:22:19 |
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NotABigDeal
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
3246 Posts |
Posted - 07/04/2009 : 10:05:14
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Is the "ghost" image backwards? Or correct?
Deal |
Gun control is like trying to reduce drunk driving by making it harder for sober people to own cars.
If you want peace, prepare for war. |
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HoardCopperByTheTon
Administrator
USA
5190 Posts |
Posted - 07/04/2009 : 10:27:11
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Sounds like a die clash to me. The dies came together without a blank between them and the image of the reverse die was transferred to the obverse die. This is then transferred to subsequent cents stuck with that die until the die wears down or they polish it out. This is sometimes called a "prisoner cent" because it looks like Lincoln is behind bars with the ghost image of the memorial over Abe's profile. Definately a keeper!
There are also folks that try to fake this error by squeezing 2 cents together in a vise to impress the image of one coin on another. Yours is most likely genuine.  |
If your percentages are low.. just sort more. If your percentages are high.. just sort more.
Let me see if I understand this? If you cross the North Korean border illegally, you get 12 years hard labor; the Iranian border illegally you are detained indefinitely. If you cross the US border illegally, you get a driver’s license, a social security card, welfare, food stamps, free health care!
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double dot
Penny Sorter Member
USA
38 Posts |
Posted - 07/04/2009 : 11:51:14
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"Is the "ghost" image backwards? Or correct?"
Impossible to tell. The part that shows is bilaterally symetric with nothing visible that could identify right versus left. I can figure out up versus down only by the curve of the column openings. There are no visible letters from the ghost image. The memorial shows on the right and left of Lincoln's head, but not much on the raised parts of his head, except on the low spots at the boundaries of the head. There is a step line on the right and left Lincoln head but that is it for an overlap.
I wish it had bars over his portrait, but the memorial column openings are mostly outside the portrait except for two low areas near the edge of the portrait.
Thanks for your help. |
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PreservingThePast
Penny Hoarding Member
USA
679 Posts |
Posted - 07/04/2009 : 11:52:29
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Cool. Please let us know what you find out about the penny.
Enjoy. |
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PreservingThePast
Penny Hoarding Member
USA
679 Posts |
Posted - 07/04/2009 : 11:55:27
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Forgot to ask this.
Saw 15 Florida odd colored (yellow/pink) rolls of pennies when I live in NY.
Got pictures??? What do you mean by odd colored and how did you know they came from Florida???
Are coin wrappers not the same across all parts of our country?
Inquiring minds want to know. Just another aspect of this hobby to learn about.
Thanks! |
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double dot
Penny Sorter Member
USA
38 Posts |
Posted - 07/04/2009 : 12:40:46
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per HCBTT "transferred to subsequent cents stuck with that die until the die wears down"
As the die wears down, the faint image would wear down on the high spots of the die first - so the bars would fade from the portrait first - stop I'm an idiot. The high spots on a coin correspond with the low spots on the die. So when two dies smack without a planchet, if the low spot of one die is low enough, it won't touch the other die's high or low spot. Now I'm confusing myself.
The rolls are printed Standard Paper Goods Orlando Florida in light red and the background paper is peach colored or beige per my arguing color sighted family members. Like many things manufactured in the US that have disapeared over time, most coin rolls are now Cointainers brand sold by Walmart or if flat type, there are only three or four styles that I normally see. The variety of the old styles was huge but rare now. Some banks used to print their own rolls but even more rarely found.
I found it entertaining but time consuming to make my own coin rolls 6 per sheet of paper with my choice of background paper color and what is printed on them. Since I found a free coin machine at a credit union I have stopped hand rolling. |
Edited by - double dot on 07/04/2009 22:13:39 |
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PreservingThePast
Penny Hoarding Member
USA
679 Posts |
Posted - 07/04/2009 : 12:57:18
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Double Dot...thanks for the info.
I found it entertaining but time consuming to make my own coin rolls 6 per sheet of paper with my choice of paper color and what is printed on them. Since I found a free coin machine at a credit union I have stopped hand rolling.
I just asked at my bank the other day about making wrappers out of plain paper and writing what denomination, amount etc, just like a real coin wrapper in case I ever ran out of wrappers and they said it wasn't allowed. Guess rules vary by banks just like their wrappers too.
This is one interesting hobby.  |
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AgCollector
Penny Pincher Member
USA
200 Posts |
Posted - 07/04/2009 : 13:37:30
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quote:
Originally posted by double dot
"Is the "ghost" image backwards? Or correct?"
Impossible to tell. The part that shows is bilaterally symetric with nothing visible that could identify right versus left. I can figure out up versus down only by the curve of the column openings. There are no visible letters from the ghost image. The memorial shows on the right and left of Lincoln's head, but not much on the raised parts of his head, except on the low spots at the boundaries of the head. There is a step line on the right and left Lincoln head but that is it for an overlap.
I wish it had bars over his portrait, but the memorial column openings are mostly outside the portrait except for two low areas near the edge of the portrait.
Thanks for your help.
Does it look like this one? This is a die clash.
http://www.lincolncentresource.com/Errors/Double_Clash.html |
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double dot
Penny Sorter Member
USA
38 Posts |
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HoardCopperByTheTon
Administrator
USA
5190 Posts |
Posted - 07/05/2009 : 00:21:30
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Great link.. I added it to my favorites.
I have a BU roll of these.. showing die progression.. Mine are copper, of course.
I save the older wrappers for a collage I am making of old penny wrappers to mount on the wall of the penny processing center. I like the white and pink horizontal striped ones.. I don't see those very often. Would love to have a few of those Florida wrappers for the artwork. |
If your percentages are low.. just sort more. If your percentages are high.. just sort more.
Let me see if I understand this? If you cross the North Korean border illegally, you get 12 years hard labor; the Iranian border illegally you are detained indefinitely. If you cross the US border illegally, you get a driver’s license, a social security card, welfare, food stamps, free health care!
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Pleasant hand sorting diversions
Now, where did I put that?
