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sheba
Penny Pincher Member
USA
114 Posts |
 Posted - 11/04/2009 : 17:54:28
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Hi All,
Copper has been bouncing around the last month or maybe longer in the 2.85/lb to slightly over 3.00/lb.
I would appreciate getting an answer or opinion sfrom any who understand 'commodities' and related pricing. My question is: how high does copper need to be, before folks really become interested in buying US or Canadian copper pennies?
I know that some folks are buying now ... such as from some online who have quantities for sale ... but I'm thinking more of the general public that is willing to buy a roll of 'wheaties', etc. What price would Memorial coppers need to be per roll to create that kind of interest?
Thanks for thoughts anyone cares to share!
sheba
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woof ... wag ... whine |
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Megaman
Penny Pincher Member
USA
130 Posts |
Posted - 11/04/2009 : 21:39:51
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personally i think 3 cents apiece would get people interested and when it hits 4 or 5 cents a piece then people will start hoarding. And by the time that happens, the people here will have a ton or two stashed away  |
Must hoard more...... |
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jonflyfish
Penny Hoarding Member
USA
548 Posts |
Posted - 11/04/2009 : 21:52:31
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| Once people learn that it is safer to hoard pennies than cutting live wires at power transmission stations. |
The first panacea for a mismanaged nation is inflation of the currency; second is war. Both bring a temporary (and false) prosperity; both bring a permanent ruin. But both are the refuge of political and economic opportunities. |
Edited by - jonflyfish on 11/04/2009 22:54:42 |
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daviscfad
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
1300 Posts |
Posted - 11/04/2009 : 22:30:56
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| I think it will take more like 5 cents for the general public to look at it for something |
Inquiring minds want to know |
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dakota1955
Penny Hoarding Member
800 Posts |
Posted - 11/05/2009 : 06:57:14
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| I think that it would be 3-5 cents, but I don't what that would be in copper price. It would also need a resell market where people could easily sell them. |
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Corsair
Penny Collector Member
485 Posts |
Posted - 11/05/2009 : 12:06:20
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| I think that the cost of copper isn't going to matter. I believe the major turning point will be when the Mint changes composition again, or removes the penny. Even if copper keeps going up, I don't think the value of the cents will rise. I mean, it's not like you can get the copper out of the penny yet to begin with. |
Am I a good person doing bad things? Or a bad person doing good things? |
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ZigMeister
Penny Sorter Member
USA
42 Posts |
Posted - 11/05/2009 : 12:17:38
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By far the cheapest form of copper bullion available today is in copper coins, ie., US Copper Cents, Canadian Copper Cents, etc. Copper coins are currently selling for a discount to MV.
All other forms of copper bullion sell 3 to 5 times the Comex raw copper price. What I think is that even if the $3 Comex price of Copper stays the same (which I think is unlikely), the price of copper coins will increase to at least double the Comex Copper price...which would put the value of US copper Cents at least at minimum of .04+. This premium will start coming into play as Copper Cents become increasingly less available in circulation. As copper becomes signicantly less a part of general circulating coinage, the treasury will lift the melt/export ban and this will cause the premiums to come into play. I've read somewhere that people start becoming aware and saving coins when their value starts to equal or exceed 3X face...so that would be my guess.
Nate (a RealCent member) at Copper Cave has a nice write-up on Copper which explains the preimiums very well.
http://www.sushob.com/copper/index.php?_a=viewDoc&docId=5 |
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jadedragon
Administrator
Canada
2808 Posts |
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rockdude
New Member
USA
21 Posts |
Posted - 11/05/2009 : 13:21:20
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| I don't think, I just hoard. |
An artist is somebody who produces things that people don't need to have.
Andy Warhol
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2old
Penny Pincher Member
136 Posts |
Posted - 11/05/2009 : 14:15:50
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quote:
Originally posted by rockdude
I don't think, I just hoard.
This fellow has the right idea! Welcome to the forum!!
I spoke with a season investor about a similar topic. Hoarding U.S. nickels, since they are 75% copper 25% nickle. His main objection to that was the same as pennies. You can not melt them. Once the moratorium on melting is lifted, we will have a new game. But, still, I have decided to slowly start a nickle hoard. If I could find fresh mint boxes at FV. That would be my preference.
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Everyone wants to go to Heaven, nobody wants to die. |
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El Dee
Penny Collector Member
USA
394 Posts |
Posted - 11/05/2009 : 14:22:22
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quote:
Originally posted by jonflyfish
Once people learn that it is safer to hoard pennies than cutting live wires at power transmission stations.
Naa, people that stupid don't know about penny composition.
Besides, hoarding is saving your own money, not stealing metal that doesn't belong to you.
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Trust the government? Ask an Indian. |
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coppernickel
Penny Sorter Member
USA
61 Posts |
Posted - 11/05/2009 : 14:31:04
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Right now there is a big push to "feed the pig." It makes sense to me to save copper cents. I want to save, but I want my savings to at least to what they were when I put them away. Copper will still be copper, but cash in the bank will worth less after inflation.
I think it will take a while before more people will begin to catch on. |
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beauanderos
Penny Collector Member
USA
388 Posts |
Posted - 11/05/2009 : 14:56:02
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We have 863 members on Realcent currently (I don't know how quickly new members are signing on but let's guess maybe 2 or 3 a day?) Some of these appear to be outside North America. Just in the US there are over 250,000,000 adults over age 18. So right now something like only 1 out of every 300,000 people has enough interest in participating in our forum (which would lead one to assume that they at least collect pennies, as opposed to sorting/saving/hoarding). I think the awareness of the value of the copper in pennies needs to expand vastly before we will see any kind of reasonable return for our efforts. Copper is too much tied to the economy right now and influenced more by housing starts then the looming threat of hyperinflation. I think most people wouldn't bother for less than 5 cents value for each penny they sell, but for us that would represent a 400% profit.  |
Hoard now and hold on!
http://coppermillions.blogspot.com/ |
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beauanderos
Penny Collector Member
USA
388 Posts |
Posted - 11/05/2009 : 14:58:45
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| It's much better to board the CU train early, even if very few of the seats are taken, then to attempt to run down the tracks trying to catch it after it's already left the station. |
Hoard now and hold on!
http://coppermillions.blogspot.com/ |
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beauanderos
Penny Collector Member
USA
388 Posts |
Posted - 11/05/2009 : 15:13:53
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quote:
Originally posted by sheba
Hi All,
Copper has been bouncing around the last month or maybe longer in the 2.85/lb to slightly over 3.00/lb.
I would appreciate getting an answer or opinion sfrom any who understand 'commodities' and related pricing. My question is: how high does copper need to be , before folks really become interested in buying US or Canadian copper pennies?
I know that some folks are buying now ... such as from some online who have quantities for sale ... but I'm thinking more of the general public that is willing to buy a roll of 'wheaties', etc. What price would Memorial coppers need to be per roll to create that kind of interest?
Thanks for thoughts anyone cares to share!
sheba
Sheba,
Extrapolating values from Coinflation, copper will have to be selling at $4.5258 per pound for pennies to be worth 3 cents each, $6.0344 per pound for pennies to be worth 4 cents each, and $7.543 per pound for pennies to be worth 5 cents each. Since there seems to be a small consensus that it might take 5 cent pennies to interest the public, you could then market your Memorial penny rolls as $2.50 in copper bullion value.
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Hoard now and hold on!
http://coppermillions.blogspot.com/ |
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beauanderos
Penny Collector Member
USA
388 Posts |
Posted - 11/05/2009 : 15:17:43
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Considering that all forms of copper would be more expensive if we did reach 5x face in value, there would very likely be a premium attached to buying affordable bullion in the form of pennies, so you might see a roll bringing in 5.5 to 6x face plus shipping. The day will come.  |
Hoard now and hold on!
http://coppermillions.blogspot.com/ |
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beauanderos
Penny Collector Member
USA
388 Posts |
Posted - 11/05/2009 : 15:25:44
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quote:
Originally posted by jadedragon
Gold Bullion and Silver bullion are still not mainstream markets. The "public" is never going to be tuned into copper pennies, but we don't need the "public" we just need a sizable interested market. All of us should try to do something to develop the market.
I think every forum member who participates in posting is doing something to develop the market, even if it is only by means of helping to expand our knowledge base. Newcomers that stumble across Realcent will discover a veritable trove of knowledge from those who have gone before that can help eliminate potential obstacles to their participation in our venture.  |
Hoard now and hold on!
http://coppermillions.blogspot.com/ |
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beauanderos
Penny Collector Member
USA
388 Posts |
Posted - 11/05/2009 : 15:32:17
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| While not everyone has the talent at writing that Jade displays (ehow, wikipedia) something that we could all do would be to email the authors of any articles written regarding copper bullion in penny form thus encouraging them to do follow-ups. Have any of our mods/admins ever considered giving an interview regarding our site? Also, if you list any copper on ebay, that's the perfect site to inform the public about the potential of copper cents as bullion. Check out what a great job Will has done on his pennybullion.com site and listings. |
Hoard now and hold on!
http://coppermillions.blogspot.com/ |
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sheba
Penny Pincher Member
USA
114 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2009 : 20:05:56
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Hey all,
THANKS! for the great opinions that have been posted. Very, very helpful and insightful. Really appreciate the thoughts that have been shared.
sheba |
woof ... wag ... whine |
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vrbsroma
Penny Collector Member
354 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2009 : 21:50:31
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| It's been mentioned before, and I'm not sure how it started, but Apmex sold coppers for a little while before they started the focus on gold/silver bullion and liquidated their numismatic holdings. I think the idea is there, but copper will never be as glamorous as gold or silver. |
As far as I know, it is stated "In God We Trust" on the US dollar. How can I trust this currency if I do not believe in God?
Possession is nine-tenths of the law.
When I give my two cents, they're always copper! |
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jadedragon
Administrator
Canada
2808 Posts |
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HoardCopperByTheTon
Administrator
USA
5238 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2009 : 23:26:22
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| I don't want it to get too popular too fast. I still don't have enough. |
If your percentages are low.. just sort more. If your percentages are high.. just sort more.
Let me see if I understand this? If you cross the North Korean border illegally, you get 12 years hard labor; the Iranian border illegally you are detained indefinitely. If you cross the US border illegally, you get a driver’s license, a social security card, welfare, food stamps, free health care!
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oober
1000+ Penny Miser Member
USA
1051 Posts |
Posted - 11/07/2009 : 00:10:05
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quote:
Originally posted by Corsair
I think that the cost of copper isn't going to matter. I believe the major turning point will be when the Mint changes composition again, or removes the penny. Even if copper keeps going up, I don't think the value of the cents will rise. I mean, it's not like you can get the copper out of the penny yet to begin with.
This is the key IMO |
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What do you think?
