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PennySaved
Penny Collector Member
359 Posts |
 Posted - 09/01/2009 : 14:56:18
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If the price of copper has gone up steadly, why hasn't the cost of circulated copper pennies?
Coininflation has the price as:
0.0185164 is the melt value for the 1909-1982 copper cent on September 01, 2009
I noticed APMEX has their pennies 1959-1982 pennies at 1.7x face.
Why isn't their a slight premium on copper coins the way there is for silver or gold coins?
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PennySaved
Penny Collector Member
359 Posts |
Posted - 09/01/2009 : 14:59:33
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| I noticed on here people are selling for 1.4x face |
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Megaman
Penny Pincher Member
USA
129 Posts |
Posted - 09/01/2009 : 15:06:21
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| The Price was actually like 1.95x face two days ago, and people sell for 1.4x face because its really hard to find a buyer for 1.7x face or more. |
Must hoard more...... |
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Corsair
Penny Collector Member
485 Posts |
Posted - 09/01/2009 : 15:06:22
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| I assume it's because they are still readily available. |
Am I a good person doing bad things? Or a bad person doing good things? |
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PennySaved
Penny Collector Member
359 Posts |
Posted - 09/01/2009 : 15:07:56
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| But when you sell for 1.4x face you are actually selling for below melt value which seems odd. |
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dakota1955
Penny Hoarding Member
800 Posts |
Posted - 09/01/2009 : 15:32:36
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| Yes that is below melt value but that is more than cost being that most of us get them for a penny by sorting pennies. |
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copperpennies
Penny Pincher Member
USA
215 Posts |
Posted - 09/01/2009 : 16:10:13
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| The sad thing is people are offering them at 1.4 but they dont sell fast, if at all. |
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Robarons
Penny Collector Member
USA
370 Posts |
Posted - 09/01/2009 : 16:22:03
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You have to sell them below melt because you can't melt them. Seems like a riddle doesn't it? Also they are quite easy to get right now with some kind of effort.
90% silver used to sell below melt at one time too, but its prices are more based on deman/supply than spot at times for example. |
Robber Baron= Robarons |
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PennySaved
Penny Collector Member
359 Posts |
Posted - 09/01/2009 : 17:09:43
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Oh ok was just trying to understand why there was a difference.
Is part of it too that silver is a precious metal and copper is an industrial metal? |
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Robarons
Penny Collector Member
USA
370 Posts |
Posted - 09/01/2009 : 17:39:10
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Yes, thats part of it. Copper is not as well known in investment form like silver. Copper is also overly bulky as well. The market is very thin, when coins shops and dealers start to pay over spot for pennies, you will see stronger prices develop.
Copper's demand as an industrial metal is also rising. Gold and silver have limited uses for the time being. Silver has mixed demand in the industrial sector in my opinion. |
Robber Baron= Robarons |
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PennySaved
Penny Collector Member
359 Posts |
Posted - 09/01/2009 : 17:48:42
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| When did wheat pennies become worth over spot? I understand that is more a nusimastic question. Just wonder at what point will pre-1982 coins start to have a nusimatic value similar to what wheat pennies have today. Will the issue of a new reverse coin design help to make those pennies more valuable over time? You don't see the demand for a 1959 penny vs a 1958 penny and I assume it is because of the wheat design that was discontinued. |
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Robarons
Penny Collector Member
USA
370 Posts |
Posted - 09/01/2009 : 17:56:11
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I think I give give my opinion on the question and step aside for the others to chime in, lol.
The wheat design is key to why people want them. Its hard to think of an example why something like a 58' is worth more than a 59' because there hasnt been very many partial changes like in the penny.
It seems only very recently wheats were worth any thing. I have heard of 1.5-2 cent buy prices a few years ago, but it has creeped up somewhat, up to 4 cents like on this forum. The lack of nusimastic appeal of the memorail cent may not matter if copper rises making the metal worth more than metal in both memorials and wheats than their collectability. |
Robber Baron= Robarons |
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RJB
New Member
19 Posts |
Posted - 09/01/2009 : 18:35:13
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quote:
Originally posted by PennySaved
When did wheat pennies become worth over spot? I understand that is more a nusimastic question. Just wonder at what point will pre-1982 coins start to have a nusimatic value similar to what wheat pennies have today. Will the issue of a new reverse coin design help to make those pennies more valuable over time? You don't see the demand for a 1959 penny vs a 1958 penny and I assume it is because of the wheat design that was discontinued.
From a numi point of view, I have a feeling that'59-82 pennies might be worth as much, maybe more than wheats, when the melt ban is lifted. People have hoarded and put away wheats for numi value, but the 59-82s will be the ones that get melted down. This will make them rare in the future. I plan on saving some of my 59-82s for my future grandkids. |
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Copper Catcher
Administrator
USA
1342 Posts |
Posted - 09/01/2009 : 18:43:44
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This is an interesting question/conversation. I think the nail was hit on the head concerning trying to sell copper pennies. Most people that are buyers, and have the time, are ready and willing to go to the bank on their own and do a little sorting to save the money.
People don't feel there is a huge rush. Yet, the day after the Mint announces they are either doing away with the penny all together or changing the metal content, then it will be a new ball game, but it will be too late because then the secret will be really out!
As a kid I remember finding lots of wheats in change and tossing them aside because they were different. Obviously there is no shortage of wheat pennies, but most are horded. Unlike silver they have not been melted in mass. Yet I'll make a little prediction: In five year or less there will no longer be a U.S. penny in circulation.
Realcent then might even have to consider changing its name!
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DISCLAIMER: The opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and are considered for entertainment purposes only. It is not the intent of this author to provide legal, investment or medical advice and nothing posted here should be considered to be so. You are advised to seek independent counsel to act upon any laws discussed in this communication. |
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barrytrot
Penny Collector Member
USA
409 Posts |
Posted - 09/01/2009 : 19:25:07
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Copper Catcher is right -> There is no shortage of Wheats!
Every day there are 1,000+ eBay auctions for suppossedly unsearched rolls in fact :)
The problem with 1959-1982 cents is that if you want some you can get them at face value. Sure you have to "sift" but still they are very readily available!
So the "after market" is very depressed and will be until getting one from your bank isn't trivial.
Once the coin type changes (i.e. steel or something) add 2 or 3 years. That is when 1959-1982 will double (at least) in value.
Prior to that, good luck even consistently getting 1.4x including shipping. |
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cwgii
Penny Collector Member
USA
498 Posts |
Posted - 09/01/2009 : 19:29:36
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right , barry,
since i cannot induce anyone to pay 131 . shipped |
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wagsthadog
Penny Collector Member
USA
473 Posts |
Posted - 09/01/2009 : 19:38:21
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Hi all-
JMO, but I think there are three major factors why 1958< coppers are a hard sell:
1) Flight to quality- While I think most people acknowledge and respect the fact that coppers are worth more than face, most would probably tie up their money in silver or gold at this time.
2) LACK of money- Even sorters like myself can have trouble keeping $500 aside at all times wihout dipping into it for gas, etc. I suspect a lot of people can't afford to tie up a few hundred dollars like that.
3) Still available in circulation/lack of awareness- Most people don't even look at pennies (think of why we still find wheats in circulation) or the hard core fellas can still average 20% Cu per box. Why pay $150 shipped for $100 in cents when I can order 20 boxes at face and get the same thing, plus a roll or two of wheats?
A lot of members have made great points. People used to scoff and toss silver coins back into circulation at one point. Not anymore. The cent's day will soon come. Hang in there and BE GRATEFUL for what you find; we are one of the few countries on the face of the earth where you can relatively conveniently order as many coins as you want and still find precious metals in circulation.
JMO
wags |
Only when they CAN'T have it, ......THEN they'll want it.
I love Cents. If you get an UNC box, you win. If you get a regular circ. box, you win. If you get a zinc box, you don't lose....so you still win. |
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PennySaved
Penny Collector Member
359 Posts |
Posted - 09/02/2009 : 10:15:04
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Thanks for all the responses.
I am a child of the 80's and always ask my mom doesn't she wish that in the 60's or 70's that she would have hoarded silver dimes, quarters, half dollars, etc.
I remember my grandma letting me go through her home change and occassionally finding a silver dime.
I just don't want to look back and kick myself because I wish I didn't hoard as many copper pennies as I could.
I am sure in the future it will pay off. Sometimes I just wonder how long it will take for the hoarding to pay off. |
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RJB
New Member
19 Posts |
Posted - 09/02/2009 : 10:22:45
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That's basically my story. For me a great pay off will be when I'm a grandfather, seeing one of my grandchildren excitedly searching through my old coins. I'm in for the long haul, not a get rich quic scheme-- although I'd like to get rich quick :)
Ihave fond memories too of searching my grandmothers silver coins.
quote:
Originally posted by PennySaved
Thanks for all the responses.
I am a child of the 80's and always ask my mom doesn't she wish that in the 60's or 70's that she would have hoarded silver dimes, quarters, half dollars, etc.
I remember my grandma letting me go through her home change and occassionally finding a silver dime.
I just don't want to look back and kick myself because I wish I didn't hoard as many copper pennies as I could.
I am sure in the future it will pay off. Sometimes I just wonder how long it will take for the hoarding to pay off.
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buyingsilvers
Penny Collector Member
437 Posts |
Posted - 09/08/2009 : 05:45:16
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| for sale prices to rise, ban needs to be lifted or the dollar needs to really tank versus other currencies or the price of copper needs to basically double or more. Without these factors, we'll keep going sideways. |
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JobIII
Penny Collector Member
USA
464 Posts |
Posted - 09/08/2009 : 13:22:04
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| Prices go for 1.3 to 1.4 at this site, but at private websites we have members selling copper cents at over 2.0 x face. It's impressive to see they are selling quite successfully. |
Selling Coppers 1.35 + shipping. *800.00* ~sold~ |
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Copper penny prices
