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beauanderos
1000+ Penny Miser Member



USA
2408 Posts

Posted - 07/07/2010 :  18:50:49  Show Profile Send beauanderos a Private Message
Thanks for the link, Chad. Looks pretty lengthy, I'll have to read it later. I was just supposing that events prophesied for the End Times were not necessarily required to be specific calamities contrived by God, but that "natural" events could lead up to them. But I haven't studied the subject. Science and religion can mesh, I feel, without one refuting the other. Back on topic... Florida is now running ads for tourism touting "The Coast is Clear." I think it said they have 663 miles of beaches, and only 9% are affected.

Hoard now and hold on!

http://coppermillions.blogspot.com/
http://wherewillyoubein2012.blogspot.com/

Edited by - beauanderos on 07/07/2010 18:52:38
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redneck
1000+ Penny Miser Member



1273 Posts

Posted - 07/08/2010 :  07:48:29  Show Profile Send redneck a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by thogey

quote:
Originally posted by thogey

I bet a small (15 KT) nuke would do the trick.

It's so far down and out to sea I just don't see the downside.

The topkill thing failed. It seems like this could go on for years.



Check this out. There is a commercial up front but check out how the Russians handled a similar problem.

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The Russian nuke may have not worked as well as they say.

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Should We Nuke the BP Oil Well?

by Washington's Blog






Global Research, July 2, 2010




CBS News, the Christian Science Monitor, CNN and Reuters have all asked whether BP should nuke its leaking oil well.

Indeed, some high-level Russian nuclear scientists and oil industry experts have suggested such that approach to stop the Gulf oil gusher. Here is archival footage of the Russians killing a gas leak with a nuclear device.

And Obama's energy secretary and Nobel prize winning physicist Steven Chu included the man who helped develop the first hydrogen bomb in the 1950s on the 5-man brain trust tasked with stopping the oil.

And oil industry expert Matt Simmons proposes the use of a tactical nuclear device every time he is interviewed on national television.

However, even the history of Russia's successful use of nuclear devices to stop gushers has some important caveats.

As the Reuters article notes:


Vladimir Chuprov from Greenpeace's Moscow office is even more insistent that BP not heed the advice of the veteran Soviet physicists. Chuprov disputes the veterans' accounts of the peaceful explosions and says several of the gas leaks reappeared later. "What was praised as a success and a breakthrough by the Soviet Union is in essence a lie," he says.

[Former long-time Russian Minister of nuclear energy and veteran Soviet physicist Viktor] Mikhailov agrees that the USSR had to give up its program because of problems it presented. "I ended the program because I knew how worthless this all was," he says with a sigh. "Radioactive material was still seeping through cracks in the ground and spreading into the air. It wasn't worth it."

The Christian Science Monitor points out:

The Russians previously used nukes at least five times to seal off gas well fires. … Komsomoloskaya Pravda suggested that the United States might as well take a chance with a nuke, based on the historical 20% failure rate. Still, the Soviet experience with nuking underground gas wells could prove easier in retrospect than trying to seal the Gulf of Mexico’s oil well disaster that’s taking place 5,000 feet below the surface. The Russians were using nukes to extinguish gas well fires in natural gas fields, not sealing oil wells gushing liquid, so there are big differences, and this method has never been tested in such conditions.

The CBS News article points out that not all of the Russians nukes worked:

But not each use of nuclear energy did the trick. A 4 kiloton charge set off in Russia's Kharkov region failed to stop a gas blowout. "The explosion was mysteriously left on the surface, forming a mushroom cloud," the paper reported.

Indeed, several experts have said that nuking the well might make the situation worse.

The Reuters article notes:


There is a chance any blast could fracture the seabed and cause an underground blowout, according to Andy Radford, petroleum engineer and American Petroleum Institute senior policy adviser on offshore issues.

The CNN report notes that nuking the leaking well could conceivably destabilize other oil wells miles away.

The New York Times writes:

Government and private nuclear experts agreed that using a nuclear bomb would be ... risky technically, with unknown and possibly disastrous consequences from radiation ....

A senior Los Alamos scientist, speaking on the condition of anonymity because his comments were unauthorized, ridiculed the idea of using a nuclear blast to solve the crisis in the gulf.

“It’s not going to happen,” he said. “Technically, it would be exploring new ground in the midst of a disaster — and you might make it worse.”

And one of the world's top physicists - string theorist Michio Kaku - writes:

I think this is a bad idea, from a physics point of view. Let me say that my mentor while I was in high school and at Harvard, Edward Teller, father of the H-bomb, was a firm advocate of using nuclear weapons to dig out canals and other grand engineering projects.

***

Underground, we then have a hollow sphere of vaporized gas, with walls that have been glassified from the sand. This hollow sphere is stable from a few hours to a few days, but eventually the weight of the rock collapses the sphere. The result is a sudden collapse of the sphere, often releasing radioactive gas into the environment.

***


If this takes place under the sea floor (which has never been done before), there are bound to be complications. First, there would be the release of dangerous, water-soluble chemicals such as radioactive iodine, strontium, and cesium, which would contaminate the food chain in the Gulf. Second, the "seal" created by the glassified sand is probably unstable. And third, it might actually make the problem worse, creating many mini leaks on the ocean floor. Determining the precise effect of such an underwater blast would depend on crucial computer simulations of the various layers of rock under the seafloor, which has never been done before.

In other words, this would bea huge science experiment, with unintended consequences. Furthermore, with hurricane season upon us, and predictions of eight or more hurricanes for this season, it means that seawater several hundred feet below the surface of the water could be churned up and then deposited over the South. This seawater, containing oils and radioactive fission products, would magnify the environmental problem.

In summary, it is not a good idea to use nukes to seal up oil leaks.

Moreover, President Bill Clinton told CNN on Sunday (starting 3:13 into video) that he has looked into the issue, and that a nuke is not needed. He said the Navy can use conventional explosives to seal the well. As the former commander-in-chief, Clinton is probably getting such information from someone high up in the Navy.
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beauanderos
1000+ Penny Miser Member



USA
2408 Posts

Posted - 07/08/2010 :  08:35:42  Show Profile Send beauanderos a Private Message
Well, if Clinton said so, then we're all safe now. Whew, glad that's over.

Hoard now and hold on!

http://coppermillions.blogspot.com/
http://wherewillyoubein2012.blogspot.com/
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PreservingThePast
1000+ Penny Miser Member



USA
1572 Posts

Posted - 07/08/2010 :  08:54:30  Show Profile Send PreservingThePast a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Mike

Wildji - There are several things I would like to point out. The first is that this is not the end of the world. Chicken Little was wrong, and environmentally at least, the sky is not falling. As I posted before, all of the environmental affects will be temporary. Just look at Alaska - you would be hard pressed to see any visible evidence of the Exxon Valdez oil spill. And since the temperatures in the Gulf of Mexico are warmer than offshore Alaska, nature will eliminate the affects of this spill more quickly.

The second point I would like to make is that no human activity is without risk or mishap. I'm an engineer myself, and I am very interested in reading the final report of what actually happened in this case. But that is beside the point. I am sickened by the hypocrisy that every thing that happens in industry must be examined under a microscope (only when it stands a chance of increasing the Government's power), and yet the almost incomprehensible screw-ups of Government get a free pass.





FYI--Our local ABC affiliate here in Central Florida has gone up there and is doing a story on the problems still there after more than 20 years. The footage they showed yesterday was astounding. Dig a hole 6 inches deep (perhaps the depth that some animals dig to forage for food) and the sheen of oil, the smell of oil, etc are still visible today.

You must be logged in to see this link.

From this search results page:

You must be logged in to see this link. valdez&sa.x=27&sa.y=6&sa=Search&stories=on&video=on

Edited by - PreservingThePast on 07/08/2010 09:39:40
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PreservingThePast
1000+ Penny Miser Member



USA
1572 Posts

Posted - 07/08/2010 :  09:04:39  Show Profile Send PreservingThePast a Private Message
Does anyone know why when I went back in to edit to try to fix the hyperlink that was showing up in the typing box for the posting but didn't show up as a complete hyperlink in the post, I typed one sentence to say why I was editing? That sentence didn't show up when I clicked on post changes or whatever the button says then. So, I went back in a second time and typed the second sentence. Neither are showing up in my original post even though I clicked to post changes.

See highlighted area below:

quote:
Originally posted by Mike

Wildji - There are several things I would like to point out. The first is that this is not the end of the world. Chicken Little was wrong, and environmentally at least, the sky is not falling. As I posted before, all of the environmental affects will be temporary. Just look at Alaska - you would be hard pressed to see any visible evidence of the Exxon Valdez oil spill. And since the temperatures in the Gulf of Mexico are warmer than offshore Alaska, nature will eliminate the affects of this spill more quickly.

The second point I would like to make is that no human activity is without risk or mishap. I'm an engineer myself, and I am very interested in reading the final report of what actually happened in this case. But that is beside the point. I am sickened by the hypocrisy that every thing that happens in industry must be examined under a microscope (only when it stands a chance of increasing the Government's power), and yet the almost incomprehensible screw-ups of Government get a free pass.





FYI--Our local ABC affiliate here in Central Florida has gone up there and is doing a story on the problems still there after more than 20 years. The footage they showed yesterday was astounding. Dig a hole 6 inches deep (perhaps the depth that some animals dig to forage for food) and the sheen of oil, the smell of oil, etc are still visible today.

You must be logged in to see this link.

From this search results page:

You must be logged in to see this link. valdez&sa.x=27&sa.y=6&sa=Search&stories=on&video=on
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PreservingThePast
1000+ Penny Miser Member



USA
1572 Posts

Posted - 07/08/2010 :  09:08:38  Show Profile Send PreservingThePast a Private Message
Edited to try to get all of the long search results link to show up as a hyperlink. Don't think I was successful.

I looked at my post and it did NOT show the above sentence so I went back in again to try to edit to show that and the sentence was visible in the typing area to make a post. Hmmmmmmm.


Am I the only one that can see the above words???

I did a full copy/paste for the above post to get these sentences to show up since they would no show up when I edited. They would not show up in my second post with a copy/paste.

Going to see if they show up here. I am beginning to feel invisible.
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PreservingThePast
1000+ Penny Miser Member



USA
1572 Posts

Posted - 07/08/2010 :  09:46:09  Show Profile Send PreservingThePast a Private Message
I also realized that the entirety of my post did not show up in either the first post, or the second post where I did a copy/paste of all of it.

What's going on??? Is anyone else having problems like this??? I don't use bad words, so why am I being edited by all of my post not showing up???

quote:
Originally posted by Mike

Wildji - There are several things I would like to point out. The first is that this is not the end of the world. Chicken Little was wrong, and environmentally at least, the sky is not falling. As I posted before, all of the environmental affects will be temporary. Just look at Alaska - you would be hard pressed to see any visible evidence of the Exxon Valdez oil spill. And since the temperatures in the Gulf of Mexico are warmer than offshore Alaska, nature will eliminate the affects of this spill more quickly.

The second point I would like to make is that no human activity is without risk or mishap. I'm an engineer myself, and I am very interested in reading the final report of what actually happened in this case. But that is beside the point. I am sickened by the hypocrisy that every thing that happens in industry must be examined under a microscope (only when it stands a chance of increasing the Government's power), and yet the almost incomprehensible screw-ups of Government get a free pass.





FYI--Our local ABC affiliate here in Central Florida has gone up there and is doing a story on the problems still there after more than 20 years. The footage they showed yesterday was astounding. Dig a hole 6 inches deep (perhaps the depth that some animals dig to forage for food) and the sheen of oil, the smell of oil, etc are still visible today.

You must be logged in to see this link.

From this search results page:

You must be logged in to see this link. valdez&sa.x=27&sa.y=6&sa=Search&stories=on&video=on
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beauanderos
1000+ Penny Miser Member



USA
2408 Posts

Posted - 07/08/2010 :  12:12:42  Show Profile Send beauanderos a Private Message
BP is now monitoring our content, Marcia

Hoard now and hold on!

http://coppermillions.blogspot.com/
http://wherewillyoubein2012.blogspot.com/
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redneck
1000+ Penny Miser Member



1273 Posts

Posted - 07/12/2010 :  07:49:56  Show Profile Send redneck a Private Message

You Are Not Authorized to See These Pictures of the Oil Spill, Citizen ... Do Not Look!




You must be logged in to see this link.

>
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beauanderos
1000+ Penny Miser Member



USA
2408 Posts

Posted - 07/12/2010 :  11:22:02  Show Profile Send beauanderos a Private Message
pretty gruesome stuff, Redneck. Thanks for posting the link.

Hoard now and hold on!

http://coppermillions.blogspot.com/
http://wherewillyoubein2012.blogspot.com/
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Beau
Penny Pincher Member



216 Posts

Posted - 07/12/2010 :  19:28:04  Show Profile Send Beau a Private Message
this video was on local TV here 2 weeks ago.
the Tv anchorman asked if he would quit flying over the oil spill since the feds had banned everyone from even flying close, he said when they either catch me on the ground and take me to jail, or they shoot me down.
now there are pictures of at least 460 brown Pelicans, our state bird, that are oil soaked and can`t fly, left there to die.
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PennyPauper
Penny Collector Member



USA
395 Posts

Posted - 07/12/2010 :  21:22:52  Show Profile Send PennyPauper a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by beauanderos

I am stunned. Lots of work to transcribe these scriptures, thanks Steve. Okay, an interpretation is in order... and I certainly don't feel worthy but... reading between the lines I think I can see where intent could convey numerous outcomes as a result of any number of causative agents. The seas will die? Thanks BP. The inland waters poisoned? Thanks Corexit rainfall. The sun scorch men? Thanks solar flares. The kingdom in darkness? Thanks massive power outages, perhaps due to an EMP. The Euphrates runs dry? Thanks global warming that melts the snowpacks at the origin of the river. Unclean spirits like frogs? Thanks France. The rest of it? Seems like perhaps Europe devastates America and New York City. A financial center brought down by a ruinous drop in the value of the euro, leading to a final plunge in the value of the dollar and eventual hyperinflation? Who really knows? Experts have pondered these passages for centuries. I think a safe reply to these implications would be Matthew 6:19-21 (New International Version)

Treasures in Heaven
19 "Do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust destroy, and where thieves break in and steal. 20 But store up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where moth and rust do not destroy, and where thieves do not break in and steal. 21 For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.



I hesitate to enter a religious talk but I have done a bit of research into Revelation lately,especially with the one verse about the oceans turning red,and waters turning bitter.But I am beginning to believe it has less to do with physical happenings on earth then it does with the spirtual battles that will unfold in the end times.
It isn't a play by play of physical events but of spiritual events.
Its not explaned in laymans terms.
I've been reading the different commentaries for Revelation on biblegateway.com,and on different versions of the bible.
If you really seek answers read all the different versions and most importantly ask the Holy Spirit for guidance.
And I echo the verse from Matthew.

Available again! $100 of Copper Lincoln Memorials for $145 shipped.
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darsemnos
Penny Sorter Member



96 Posts

Posted - 07/13/2010 :  16:55:11  Show Profile Send darsemnos a Private Message
Interesting twist:

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cptindy
Penny Hoarding Member



572 Posts

Posted - 07/13/2010 :  19:58:05  Show Profile Send cptindy a Private Message
A geologists perspective


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"It is the nature of the human species to reject what is true but unpleasant and to embrace what is obviously false but comforting"

" The average man doesn't want to be free. He wants to be safe."

H.L. Mencken

http://silver-news-today.com/
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Beau
Penny Pincher Member



216 Posts

Posted - 07/15/2010 :  19:54:05  Show Profile Send Beau a Private Message
They capped it today, we will know in a few days if it holds!
even with a hurricane.
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hobo finds
Penny Hoarding Member



838 Posts

Posted - 07/15/2010 :  20:00:19  Show Profile Send hobo finds a Private Message
I don't think that it would hold if even if it was inserted in Obama's arse!
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hobo finds
Penny Hoarding Member



838 Posts

Posted - 04/20/2011 :  09:26:57  Show Profile Send hobo finds a Private Message
One year later...
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